Did anybody attend the CTC/CUK AGM?

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Philip Benstead
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Did anybody attend the CTC/CUK AGM?

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Did anybody attend the CTC/CUK AGM?

If yes any comments
If no why?
Philip Benstead | Life Member Former CTC Councillor/Trustee
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Re: Did anybody attend the CTC/CUK AGM?

Post by Jdsk »

Are you concerned about something that happened or didn't happen at the AGM?

If so please could you tell us what it was.

Thanks

Jonathan
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Philip Benstead
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Re: Did anybody attend the CTC/CUK AGM?

Post by Philip Benstead »

Jdsk wrote: 10 Sep 2022, 9:06pm Are you concerned about something that happened or didn't happen at the AGM?

If so please could you tell us what it was.

Thanks

Jonathan
It just that due to the apparent lack of interest in the annual report I think the club is dying at the club level.
Last edited by Philip Benstead on 13 Sep 2022, 1:40pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Did anybody attend the CTC/CUK AGM?

Post by Jdsk »

Thanks

Jonathan
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Re: Did anybody attend the CTC/CUK AGM?

Post by Steady rider »

In the old days the CTC allowed motions to be submitted by one member with a seconder, possibly 50+ people may have attended the AGM.

This meant any issue of concern could be raised speakers for or against, and a vote taken. The whole set up is geared to help the board/ management get their way on issues. Some of the time, this will be of benefit but in time people see the process as one sided and bias.

Today motions require approving, in meeting a criteria set by the board and limited to two submissions per member.
The change may have been well meaning, but it can also restrict or discourage submissions. It probably means avoiding talking about some aspects of policy.

I gather about 20 people attended this years AGM, including trustees, from about 70,000 members. It shows a lack of interest in the AGM and it seems to be going backwards. The old approach seemed to deliver a better outcome, with more interest from members.
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Re: Did anybody attend the CTC/CUK AGM?

Post by PH »

Philip Benstead wrote: 10 Sep 2022, 8:55pm Did anybody attend the CTC/CUK AGM?

If yes any comments
If no why?
No, why would I?
The motions are already decided, the vast majority of votes are already cast, what purpose would there be in attending?
I've only been to one, it was only a mile from home, but even the free buffet didn't make it worthwhile. There was nothing to be said or done at the meeting which would in any way influence the outcome. Yet still members would get up and spend ages proposing and opposing motions which were already decided. Why? Is it some kind of ego trip? Do they just like practicing public speaking, most of them could certainly have done with some practice.
I have been to and enjoyed some of the get togethers organised before the pandemic, they were much more worthwhile, interesting speakers, a chance to talk to CUK staff, and more importantly to get to know and learn from other members. I hope there'll be more of those in the future.
the apparent lack of interest in the annual report I think the club is drying at the club level.
I don't know how you judge that interest, you could be right, but people don't necessarily display their interest. As for this "Club level" - where and when was that? I'm a relative newcomer compared to some, having only been a member for 23 years, in that time most of the club stuff has gone on at a local level, with varying degrees of support from HQ. Hasn't that always been the case? I've read DA AGM reports bemoaning the lack of support written in the 1930's.
Isn't this just the way clubs/organisations/groups are, cycling or anything else? Even on a local level a group with a couple of hundred active members is probably being effectively run by half a dozen.
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Re: Did anybody attend the CTC/CUK AGM?

Post by Philip Benstead »

PH wrote: 13 Sep 2022, 1:26pm
Philip Benstead wrote: 10 Sep 2022, 8:55pm Did anybody attend the CTC/CUK AGM?

If yes any comments
If no why?
No, why would I?
The motions are already decided, the vast majority of votes are already cast, what purpose would there be in attending?


Since the introduction of proxy votes, the CHAIR will decide the outcome. So I agree, what can be done to counter this?


I've only been to one, it was only a mile from home, but even the free buffet didn't make it worthwhile. There was nothing to be said or done at the meeting which would in any way influence the outcome. Yet still members would get up and spend ages proposing and opposing motions which were already decided. Why? Is it some kind of ego trip?

Do they just like practicing public speaking, most of them could certainly have done with some practice.

That rather harsh, we are members of the CTC, we have the right to express a view even if badly.


I have been to and enjoyed some of the get-togethers organized before the pandemic, they were much more worthwhile, interesting speakers, a chance to talk to CUK staff, and more importantly to get to know and learn from other members.

I hope there'll be more of those in the future. Yes, but let as many members know about these events as possible.

the apparent lack of interest in the annual report I think the club is drying at the club level.

I don't know how you judge that interest, you could be right, but people don't necessarily display their interest.

Some local groups appear to be reluctant to advertise their activities, refusing to publish their ride on the web for all to see .

At the local level, very few turn up to the local AGM, sometimes a handful.



As for this "Club level" - where and when was that? I'm a relative newcomer compared to some, having only been a member for 23 years, in that time most of the club stuff has gone on at a local level, with varying degrees of support from HQ.

I have been a member for 51 years, in the 1970s there were many more activities, IMHO but rote was set in there, in many cases the local groups were complacent not welcoming a refresh of club officers, the same reelected time after time, so now these people are dying off and there is nobody to replace them, our organization memory as been lost.


Hasn't that always been the case?
I've read DA AGM reports bemoaning the lack of support written in the 1930s. All organizations go through circles of decay, but this time society has changed, people are either too busy or have more money to do other activities to distract them, so cycling is just one of many activities.


Isn't this just the way clubs/organizations/groups are, cycling, or anything else?

Even on a local level, a group with a couple of hundred active members is probably being effectively run by half a dozen. YES, but we need to get replacements for these people.
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Re: Did anybody attend the CTC/CUK AGM?

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Steady rider wrote: 12 Sep 2022, 10:52pm In the old days the CTC allowed motions to be submitted by one member with a seconder, possibly 50+ people may have attended the AGM.

<snip>

I gather about 20 people attended this years AGM, including trustees, from about 70,000 members. It shows a lack of interest in the AGM and it seems to be going backwards. The old approach seemed to deliver a better outcome, with more interest from members.
You'll be delighted to hear that the voting report shows 50+ members (in fact over 1600) attended the AGM, with the vast majority attending by proxy. The provision of proxy voting is a legal requirement, not the result of some dark conspiracy.

Edit: Fixed link
Last edited by gaz on 13 Sep 2022, 8:56pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Did anybody attend the CTC/CUK AGM?

Post by Philip Benstead »

gaz wrote: 13 Sep 2022, 7:41pm
Steady rider wrote: 12 Sep 2022, 10:52pm In the old days the CTC allowed motions to be submitted by one member with a seconder, possibly 50+ people may have attended the AGM.

<snip>

I gather about 20 people attended this years AGM, including trustees, from about 70,000 members. It shows a lack of interest in the AGM and it seems to be going backwards. The old approach seemed to deliver a better outcome, with more interest from members.
You'll be delighted to hear that the voting report shows 50+ members (in fact over 1600) attended the AGM, with the vast majority attending by proxy. The provision of proxy voting is a legal requirement, not the result of some dark conspiracy.
i was told by the AGM admin is was 23 attendees, some people must have logged on late. Anyway 50 is still a low number. But where did you get the number 50+ from?
Last edited by Philip Benstead on 13 Sep 2022, 8:59pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Did anybody attend the CTC/CUK AGM?

Post by Philip Benstead »

Garry your link does not work
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Re: Did anybody attend the CTC/CUK AGM?

Post by Steady rider »

Attending allows people to hear both sides of any motion, before voting if they wish. Proxy voting means voting before hearing people speak. The outcome with 23 people attending shows the AGM process needs reviewing. Even if reviewed I doubt the outcome will be much better, its the approach that matters.
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Re: Did anybody attend the CTC/CUK AGM?

Post by gaz »

Philip Benstead wrote: 13 Sep 2022, 8:13pmGarry your link does not work
Thank you, now fixed.
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Re: Did anybody attend the CTC/CUK AGM?

Post by gaz »

Philip Benstead wrote: 13 Sep 2022, 8:11pm i was told by the AGM admin is was 23 attendees, some people must have logged on late. Anyway 50 is still a low number. But where did you get the number 50+ from?
Whilst I do not know the wording of your question, you have reported on another thread that you were told that 23 members were present.
Philip Benstead wrote: 9 Sep 2022, 11:35am CTC AGM 2022

Admin11:31
In response to the question, we have 23 members present at the AGM
Members do not need to be present to be in attendance, Articles of Association 12.2. Perhaps the answer you received was poorly worded, perhaps it was precisely worded, in either case the voting results show us over 1600 members attended.
Steady rider wrote: 13 Sep 2022, 8:23pm... its the approach that matters.
Which is why proxy voting is allowed and encouraged. Do you think Cycling UK should not meet its legal obligations to provide a proxy voting mechanism to its members?
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Re: Did anybody attend the CTC/CUK AGM?

Post by PH »

Steady rider wrote: 13 Sep 2022, 8:23pm Proxy voting means voting before hearing people speak.
That is exactly what it means, it makes the numbers physically attending an irrelevance.
There is an argument for better debate prior to an AGM, but I've seen no evidence that it'd raise the level of interest. What shouldn't be done is point to the low physical attendance at a meeting and use it as evidence for anything else.
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Re: Did anybody attend the CTC/CUK AGM?

Post by Philip Benstead »

Should we do away with the AGM then?
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