Having escaped COVID all this time ...

DevonDamo
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Re: Having escaped COVID all this time ...

Post by DevonDamo »

horizon wrote: 20 Sep 2022, 11:44am
Carlton green wrote: 20 Sep 2022, 8:12am I can now book my vaccination booster and intend to do so.
if you carefully read all the other posts in this thread, you may come to a different conclusion. :wink:
Threads like this are gold dust for anyone wanting to question the efficacy/safety of vaccines because people will be joining the discussion with their experiences of Covid. People who haven't had any Covid symptoms are unlikely to join the discussion, and we have no way of knowing how many of the people reporting mild illness in this thread would have been seriously ill or dead without the vaccine. (I'm not suggesting that a large proportion of people would have had serious outcomes: just enough to overwhelm the NHS - e.g.. 3 or 4 percent of a huge number of infected people.)

If the silent majority were to add their 2p, threads like this would be very, very long, and I suspect you'd find a lot more experiences like mine, i.e. I've had all my vaccines and booster, with absolutely no side-effects, and have been at the centre of many outbreaks, including drunkenly sharing cans of beer at festivals with mates who succumbed to Covid the following day (i.e. they were infected whilst I was drinking their backwash) - I've never tested positive and don't have any reason to believe I've ever been infected.
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Cowsham
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Re: Having escaped COVID all this time ...

Post by Cowsham »

My diabetic friend was going slightly mad trying to avoid covid. I was getting a bit worried more for her mental health until she eventually got it. Being fully jabbed up she had cold symptoms but no real problems with it.
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Dingdong
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Re: Having escaped COVID all this time ...

Post by Dingdong »

DevonDamo wrote: 20 Sep 2022, 2:22pm
horizon wrote: 20 Sep 2022, 11:44am
Carlton green wrote: 20 Sep 2022, 8:12am I can now book my vaccination booster and intend to do so.
if you carefully read all the other posts in this thread, you may come to a different conclusion. :wink:

If the silent majority were to add their 2p, threads like this would be very, very long, and I suspect you'd find a lot more experiences like mine, i.e. I've had all my vaccines and booster, with absolutely no side-effects, and have been at the centre of many outbreaks, including drunkenly sharing cans of beer at festivals with mates who succumbed to Covid the following day (i.e. they were infected whilst I was drinking their backwash) - I've never tested positive and don't have any reason to believe I've ever been infected.
I too thought I would never be infected (I went to a small local festival end of autumn last year, where 450 people got covid in one sitting). One thing is for sure, COVID is with us, and it's here to stay. Perhaps for decades to come. Is repetitious, ever less effective vaccination the answer? I don't know, perhaps we'll just have to deal with it the same way as seasonal flu: something to be expected and endured at least once every few years.

I've had side effects from the Pfiszer vaccine, and contrary to their blurb, they lasted several months, not 'a few days'. Nevertheless I took them and will probably take them again. I would not wish this infection on anyone. I can't remember ever feeling this bad from a viral infection in all my life.
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Cowsham
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Re: Having escaped COVID all this time ...

Post by Cowsham »

My experience was that I felt better after the 10 days of symptoms than I did before I got it.

Don't know if it was the rest from vigorous activity or just psychological that I'd beat it without too much trouble but it gave me a spring in my step after.

( I'd had 2 vaccine doses by that time in March this year )

I also take vitamin D since sunshine in NI is scarce.
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DevonDamo
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Re: Having escaped COVID all this time ...

Post by DevonDamo »

Dingdong wrote: 20 Sep 2022, 2:43pmPerhaps for decades to come. Is repetitious, ever less effective vaccination the answer?
I know what you mean - my understanding is that Omicron has resulted in higher risk of infection, but lower risk of serious outcomes. I'm sure the powers-that-be are continually crunching the numbers for each new variant to decide whether continuation of the national vaccination campaign is required. If they come to a point where they conclude that the health service can cope regardless of whether people are taking the vaccine, then I will probably stop taking it. (This would be for the same reason I don't take the flu vaccine, despite it being a recommendation - I don't believe I've ever had the flu, so I'm making a completely unscientific judgement that I don't need it.)
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Cowsham
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Re: Having escaped COVID all this time ...

Post by Cowsham »

DevonDamo wrote: 20 Sep 2022, 3:47pm
Dingdong wrote: 20 Sep 2022, 2:43pmPerhaps for decades to come. Is repetitious, ever less effective vaccination the answer?
I know what you mean - my understanding is that Omicron has resulted in higher risk of infection, but lower risk of serious outcomes. I'm sure the powers-that-be are continually crunching the numbers for each new variant to decide whether continuation of the national vaccination campaign is required. If they come to a point where they conclude that the health service can cope regardless of whether people are taking the vaccine, then I will probably stop taking it. (This would be for the same reason I don't take the flu vaccine, despite it being a recommendation - I don't believe I've ever had the flu, so I'm making a completely unscientific judgement that I don't need it.)
I used to think that way too but as someone pointed out to me, it's probably others vaccines that are protecting you.

My view changed after my son took swine flu that very nearly killed him. I figured I was selfish in not being vaccinated. Saying all that I didn't seem to take swine flu even though I was with him 24/7 in icu for a week. ( I did feel something at me after 6 days but it didn't manifest into anything serious )
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DevonDamo
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Re: Having escaped COVID all this time ...

Post by DevonDamo »

Cowsham wrote: 20 Sep 2022, 4:01pm I used to think that way too but as someone pointed out to me, it's probably others vaccines that are protecting you.
Yes - my approach to the flu vaccine is unscientific and uninformed, i.e. I don't even know whether the recommendation that I take the vaccine is based on the authorities wanting me to contribute to herd immunity. (I suspect not as the recommendation is aimed at older people and those with vulnerabilities, which suggests the objective of the vaccine is simply to protect the recipient.) With Covid, my understanding is that you're still likely to get infected despite being vaccinated, but the risk of serious outcomes is significantly reduced. For that reason, I'm assuming that whether I'm vaccinated or not, I'm still likely to get infected and infect others, so my decision on whether to take it will be based on the risks to myself rather than contributing to herd immunity. However, I'm clearly no immunologist or statistician, so if the health authorities tell me that vaccination is a public, as well as an individual, health measure, then I'll have it.
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Cowsham
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Re: Having escaped COVID all this time ...

Post by Cowsham »

BTW coronavirus isn't a flu -- flu is influenza virus and covid-19 is a coronavirus.

Flu is much more serious condition than a coronavirus which is responsible for the common cold as well as the novel virus covid-19.

The difference is that it is novel ie it is a new virus so no one is immune to it but that means many people catching it at the same time which is a problem.

As said upthread 3 or 4% of a large number of people having life threatening injuries from it is still a large number of people.

Another problem is vaccines -- flu is a much less complex virus to make a vaccine for -- have you ever wondered why there's never been a vaccine for the common cold ? That's because it's a much more complex virus hence the skepticism of many scientists about how long it would take to make a vaccine for c19.
Also the common cold isn't a novel virus so not everyone catches it at the same time so 3 to 4 % of a small number catching it is a very small number indeed.
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Cowsham
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Re: Having escaped COVID all this time ...

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DevonDamo wrote: 20 Sep 2022, 4:14pm
Cowsham wrote: 20 Sep 2022, 4:01pm I used to think that way too but as someone pointed out to me, it's probably others vaccines that are protecting you.
Yes - my approach to the flu vaccine is unscientific and uninformed, i.e. I don't even know whether the recommendation that I take the vaccine is based on the authorities wanting me to contribute to herd immunity. (I suspect not as the recommendation is aimed at older people and those with vulnerabilities, which suggests the objective of the vaccine is simply to protect the recipient.) With Covid, my understanding is that you're still likely to get infected despite being vaccinated, but the risk of serious outcomes is significantly reduced. For that reason, I'm assuming that whether I'm vaccinated or not, I'm still likely to get infected and infect others, so my decision on whether to take it will be based on the risks to myself rather than contributing to herd immunity. However, I'm clearly no immunologist or statistician, so if the health authorities tell me that vaccination is a public, as well as an individual, health measure, then I'll have it.
The reason older people are vulnerable is simply down to the age of your T cells and larger numbers of ac2 receptors. A young person has young T cells which react quickly to invading viruses. Older T cells take more time to find the virus busting key and it's this time that makes a big difference in your outcomes.

You'll also have a larger number of ac2 receptors so your viral load will be bigger. This is why obesity is a major factor in covid-19 outcomes.

The fatter you have been throughout your lifetime ( not how fat you are now ) will be a factor in how many ac2 receptors you will have accumulated over your lifetime. Which explains why a little 90 year old bird of woman who's been thin and active all her life will more often than not brush covid-19 off no problem whereas an obese man half her age could have a very bad outcome.

You can be thin and have all the above risk factors.
Last edited by Cowsham on 20 Sep 2022, 4:44pm, edited 2 times in total.
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pwa
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Re: Having escaped COVID all this time ...

Post by pwa »

mjr wrote: 20 Sep 2022, 1:56pm
pwa wrote: 20 Sep 2022, 6:38am Does it matter all that much? If you are not especially vulnerable, it is just another bug that will make you feel bad for a week and then leave you with a boosted immune system. If you are up to date with the jabs you are almost certain to come out of it okay. In another week you will probably be healthy again, but with higher immunity.
With Omicron, you don't get much boosted/higher immunity, according to the research. Reinfections are now more common. Vaccinated people will probably survive, but it's still horrible and a lottery ticket that you should try not to buy.

I'm just recovering. You could dismiss it as merely "feel bad" but that feels like understating screaming joint pain and slipping into unconsciousness one afternoon. Even the lead bad bits were like a really awful head cold. I was off the bike all week and even now, testing negative and heart rate back down, I feel sort of hollowed-out and weakened. Avoid it as long as reasonably possible, I'd say!

I suspect I caught it while spending hours in an underventilated waiting area with dozens of others, including some unmasked people sneezing, due to transport disruption (so I couldn't easily leave the building without further disrupting my journey). I knew the trip was a risk and I'm just glad that infection probably happened on the journey home, so I probably haven't spread covid on tour.
I have spoken to a lot of people who have had Covid, some (distanced) while they had it, and your experinece sounds similar to other accounts I've had. People tend to liken it to flu, and I have had flu that resulted in delerium, so maybe that is a good analogy for someone who hasn't yet had it. Anyway, hopefully you will gradually get back your strength over the next few weeks.

One good thing you can take from it is that you will now have some protection against further serious infection for a while. Not 100% of course.
roubaixtuesday
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Re: Having escaped COVID all this time ...

Post by roubaixtuesday »

Cowsham wrote: 20 Sep 2022, 4:21pm BTW coronavirus isn't a flu -- flu is influenza virus and covid-19 is a coronavirus.

Flu is much more serious condition than a coronavirus which is responsible for the common cold as well as the novel virus covid-19.

The difference is that it is novel ie it is a new virus so no one is immune to it but that means many people catching it at the same time which is a problem.

As said upthread 3 or 4% of a large number of people having life threatening injuries from it is still a large number of people.

Another problem is vaccines -- flu is a much less complex virus to make a vaccine for -- have you ever wondered why there's never been a vaccine for the common cold ? That's because it's a much more complex virus hence the skepticism of many scientists about how long it would take to make a vaccine for c19.
Also the common cold isn't a novel virus so not everyone catches it at the same time so 3 to 4 % of a small number catching it is a very small number indeed.
The common cold is not caused by a single virus, or even a single family of viruses.

Dozens of different adenoviruses, rhinoviruses, coronaviruses etc cause symptoms we call the common cold.

I've no idea how you are classifying virus "complexity".
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Re: Having escaped COVID all this time ...

Post by Psamathe »

DevonDamo wrote: 20 Sep 2022, 2:22pm ...
Threads like this are gold dust for anyone wanting to question the efficacy/safety of vaccines because people will be joining the discussion with their experiences of Covid. People who haven't had any Covid symptoms are unlikely to join the discussion, and we have no way of knowing how many of the people reporting mild illness in this thread would have been seriously ill or dead without the vaccine. ...
It is an interesting aspect. Over the last month I've been thinking how well the vaccines seem to have worked in me. 5 weeks cycle touring in the Netherlands which for me means in a supermarket every day (or occasional restaurant) and the entire time I saw one person wearing a mask. So I felt I must have been exposed to it so either vaccines worked for me or I've been asymptomatic. (Of course it's possible I avoided being exposed but I'd guess odds against that).

Nothing deliberate in my behaviour, just "going with the flow" which seems to have been pandemic over, life as (pre-pandemic) normal.

Having tempted fate, next week I'll probably be posting "me too".

Ian
pwa
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Re: Having escaped COVID all this time ...

Post by pwa »

Psamathe wrote: 20 Sep 2022, 4:55pm
DevonDamo wrote: 20 Sep 2022, 2:22pm ...
Threads like this are gold dust for anyone wanting to question the efficacy/safety of vaccines because people will be joining the discussion with their experiences of Covid. People who haven't had any Covid symptoms are unlikely to join the discussion, and we have no way of knowing how many of the people reporting mild illness in this thread would have been seriously ill or dead without the vaccine. ...
It is an interesting aspect. Over the last month I've been thinking how well the vaccines seem to have worked in me. 5 weeks cycle touring in the Netherlands which for me means in a supermarket every day (or occasional restaurant) and the entire time I saw one person wearing a mask. So I felt I must have been exposed to it so either vaccines worked for me or I've been asymptomatic. (Of course it's possible I avoided being exposed but I'd guess odds against that).

Nothing deliberate in my behaviour, just "going with the flow" which seems to have been pandemic over, life as (pre-pandemic) normal.

Having tempted fate, next week I'll probably be posting "me too".

Ian
The biggest chunk of evidence in favour of the vaccines is the fact that hospitals are no longer treating large numbers of people in need of invasive treatment just to keep them breathing. The vaccines are greatly reducing the seriousness of the various strains of Covid for the great majority of people, making it very unlikely you will be hospitalised because of it, and even more unlikely you will die from it. Though some of the latter effect will be down to improved post-infection treatments for people who need them.
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Re: Having escaped COVID all this time ...

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pwa wrote: 20 Sep 2022, 4:39pm One good thing you can take from it is that you will now have some protection against further serious infection for a while. Not 100% of course.
As vaccinated, I already had some and research suggests omicron infection offers little boost to that.

Also, it's nasty enough that I'm keen not to have even another mild case if I can avoid it easily.
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pwa
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Re: Having escaped COVID all this time ...

Post by pwa »

mjr wrote: 20 Sep 2022, 5:36pm
pwa wrote: 20 Sep 2022, 4:39pm One good thing you can take from it is that you will now have some protection against further serious infection for a while. Not 100% of course.
As vaccinated, I already had some and research suggests omicron infection offers little boost to that.

Also, it's nasty enough that I'm keen not to have even another mild case if I can avoid it easily.
I have thought about this before and concluded that realistically, in my place of work I have to touch so many surfaces touched by others, on so many occasions during each working day, that there is no way I could avoid Covid permanently. I doubt anyone can, unless they stay alone and indoors all the time. Face masks help a bit, but only a bit.
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