Dallian Atkinson aquittal

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mumbojumbo
Posts: 1525
Joined: 1 Aug 2018, 8:18pm

Dallian Atkinson aquittal

Post by mumbojumbo »

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-s ... e-63063137

This shows how important it is to attend a court session. and listen to all the evidence.A person ,lying on the ground as a result of several uses of a taser ,would seem to offer little threat.
[edited by moderator]
Mr Atkinson died in hospital about an hour after Monk tasered him and kicked him in the head with enough force to leave imprints of his bootlaces.

PC Bettley-Smith struck him three times with her baton while he was lying on the ground after the final discharge.

Prosecutors argued that PC Bettley-Smith, while not contributing to Mr Atkinson's death, caused him actual bodily harm.

They told the court she was "angry" with Mr Atkinson, who they said was lying on the ground and posing no threat, however jurors agreed with the defence that the officer had used her baton lawfully as a last resort.
slowster
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Re: Dallian Atkinson aquittal

Post by slowster »

mumbojumbo wrote: 28 Sep 2022, 6:38pm https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-s ... e-63063137

This shows how important it is to attend a court session. and listen to all the evidence.A person ,lying on the ground as a result of several uses of a taser ,would seem to offer little threat. [edited by moderator]
The article does not state that the officer struck him on the head. I suggest you read the article more carefully, and also read some of the other news articles on the case, which provide additional detail.
jois
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Joined: 22 Sep 2022, 12:29pm

Re: Dallian Atkinson aquittal

Post by jois »

mumbojumbo wrote: 28 Sep 2022, 6:38pm https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-s ... e-63063137

This shows how important it is to attend a court session. and listen to all the evidence.A person ,lying on the ground as a result of several uses of a taser ,would seem to offer little threat. [edited by moderator]
The British public seem to find it hard to convict police officers of serious matters, seemingly unable to believe they might strike a harmless man lay on the floor, something they may be more ready to believe if it had happened to them.
pwa
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Re: Dallian Atkinson aquittal

Post by pwa »

jois wrote: 28 Sep 2022, 9:26pm
mumbojumbo wrote: 28 Sep 2022, 6:38pm https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-s ... e-63063137

This shows how important it is to attend a court session. and listen to all the evidence.A person ,lying on the ground as a result of several uses of a taser ,would seem to offer little threat. However a jury felt it acceptable for an officer to strike him on the head with a baton several times.
The British public seem to find it hard to convict police officers of serious matters, seemingly unable to believe they might strike a harmless man lay on the floor, something they may be more ready to believe if it had happened to them.
If you read the item fully you will see that one officer was convicted of manslaughter in 2021 due to his part in this incident. The doubt was over the role of his young, inexperienced female colleague who claimed she was in fear at the time. I don't think that in the cool light of day her actions were always right, but I find it possible to believe that she acted with fear and confusion, and possibly even panic.
jois
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Re: Dallian Atkinson aquittal

Post by jois »

pwa wrote: 28 Sep 2022, 10:08pm
jois wrote: 28 Sep 2022, 9:26pm
mumbojumbo wrote: 28 Sep 2022, 6:38pm https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-s ... e-63063137

This shows how important it is to attend a court session. and listen to all the evidence.A person ,lying on the ground as a result of several uses of a taser ,would seem to offer little threat. [edited by moderator]
The British public seem to find it hard to convict police officers of serious matters, seemingly unable to believe they might strike a harmless man lay on the floor, something they may be more ready to believe if it had happened to them.
If you read the item fully you will see that one officer was convicted of manslaughter in 2021 due to his part in this incident. The doubt was over the role of his young, inexperienced female colleague who claimed she was in fear at the time. I don't think that in the cool light of day her actions were always right, but I find it possible to believe that she acted with fear and confusion, and possibly even panic.
Tha was down from a murder charge, so.....

Yea your right , bloke lay unconscious on the floor dieing, clearly any normal person would panic and give a few clouts with a metal stick. Perfectly reasonable in my opinion
Tangled Metal
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Re: Dallian Atkinson aquittal

Post by Tangled Metal »

Three strikes of a baton to an incapacitated man. Size has no relevance when you're laid low on the ground by a taser. Three baton strikes is OK when your a copper who's too scared to do your job professionally. It's a hard job but if fear makes you strike a downed man are you in the right job?

Anyone like British justice? Well she's due to go under a disciplinary action. Anyone expect her to be a police officer after that? I do!
jois
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Joined: 22 Sep 2022, 12:29pm

Re: Dallian Atkinson aquittal

Post by jois »

Tangled Metal wrote: 28 Sep 2022, 10:34pm Three strikes of a baton to an incapacitated man. Size has no relevance when you're laid low on the ground by a taser. Three baton strikes is OK when your a copper who's too scared to do your job professionally. It's a hard job but if fear makes you strike a downed man are you in the right job?

Anyone like British justice? Well she's due to go under a disciplinary action. Anyone expect her to be a police officer after that? I do!
The report said ex pc ,one assumes she resigned
Jdsk
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Re: Dallian Atkinson aquittal

Post by Jdsk »

jois wrote: 28 Sep 2022, 10:43pm
Tangled Metal wrote: 28 Sep 2022, 10:34pm Three strikes of a baton to an incapacitated man. Size has no relevance when you're laid low on the ground by a taser. Three baton strikes is OK when your a copper who's too scared to do your job professionally. It's a hard job but if fear makes you strike a downed man are you in the right job?

Anyone like British justice? Well she's due to go under a disciplinary action. Anyone expect her to be a police officer after that? I do!
The report said ex pc ,one assumes she resigned
Where does it say that, please?

Jonathan
jois
Posts: 334
Joined: 22 Sep 2022, 12:29pm

Re: Dallian Atkinson aquittal

Post by jois »

Jdsk wrote: 28 Sep 2022, 10:57pm
jois wrote: 28 Sep 2022, 10:43pm
Tangled Metal wrote: 28 Sep 2022, 10:34pm Three strikes of a baton to an incapacitated man. Size has no relevance when you're laid low on the ground by a taser. Three baton strikes is OK when your a copper who's too scared to do your job professionally. It's a hard job but if fear makes you strike a downed man are you in the right job?

Anyone like British justice? Well she's due to go under a disciplinary action. Anyone expect her to be a police officer after that? I do!
The report said ex pc ,one assumes she resigned
Where does it say that, please?

Jonathan
Thought I read it in the above link, looked again I might be mistaken
pete75
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Joined: 24 Jul 2007, 2:37pm

Re: Dallian Atkinson aquittal

Post by pete75 »

Tangled Metal wrote: 28 Sep 2022, 10:34pm Three strikes of a baton to an incapacitated man. Size has no relevance when you're laid low on the ground by a taser. Three baton strikes is OK when your a copper who's too scared to do your job professionally. It's a hard job but if fear makes you strike a downed man are you in the right job?

Anyone like British justice? Well she's due to go under a disciplinary action. Anyone expect her to be a police officer after that? I do!
Why is she still a police officer? She was found not guilty on the basis of reasonable doubt. If they sacked her she could take them to a tribunal for unfair dismissal but they work on balance of probability so she'd lose.
'Give me my bike, a bit of sunshine - and a stop-off for a lunchtime pint - and I'm a happy man.' - Reg Baker
pete75
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Re: Dallian Atkinson aquittal

Post by pete75 »

pwa wrote: 28 Sep 2022, 10:08pm
If you read the item fully you will see that one officer was convicted of manslaughter in 2021 due to his part in this incident. The doubt was over the role of his young, inexperienced female colleague who claimed she was in fear at the time. I don't think that in the cool light of day her actions were always right, but I find it possible to believe that she acted with fear and confusion, and possibly even panic.
Acting out of fear when in "action". If a soldier acts out of fear isn't that called cowardice in the face of the enemy and attracts severe punishment....
'Give me my bike, a bit of sunshine - and a stop-off for a lunchtime pint - and I'm a happy man.' - Reg Baker
pwa
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Joined: 2 Oct 2011, 8:55pm

Re: Dallian Atkinson aquittal

Post by pwa »

jois wrote: 28 Sep 2022, 10:23pm
pwa wrote: 28 Sep 2022, 10:08pm
jois wrote: 28 Sep 2022, 9:26pm

The British public seem to find it hard to convict police officers of serious matters, seemingly unable to believe they might strike a harmless man lay on the floor, something they may be more ready to believe if it had happened to them.
If you read the item fully you will see that one officer was convicted of manslaughter in 2021 due to his part in this incident. The doubt was over the role of his young, inexperienced female colleague who claimed she was in fear at the time. I don't think that in the cool light of day her actions were always right, but I find it possible to believe that she acted with fear and confusion, and possibly even panic.
Tha was down from a murder charge, so.....

Yea your right , bloke lay unconscious on the floor dieing, clearly any normal person would panic and give a few clouts with a metal stick. Perfectly reasonable in my opinion
That's just it though. You are expecting a young recruit who is afraid of a violent person who is much larger and stronger than her and her colleague to act with calm rationality as if she were sat at a desk in a calm atmosphere. And he wasn't necessarily unconscious at that point. She may have had reason to fear that he would get up again. I don't think she handled the situation well. I think she handled it as you and I might, terrified and driven by a desire to simply stop the threat to her own life. The jury must have bleieved that she was afraid he would get up again and possibly take her life. Add to all that the fact that her own attack on the man did not cause his death.
Last edited by pwa on 29 Sep 2022, 5:17am, edited 2 times in total.
pwa
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Joined: 2 Oct 2011, 8:55pm

Re: Dallian Atkinson aquittal

Post by pwa »

pete75 wrote: 29 Sep 2022, 12:31am
pwa wrote: 28 Sep 2022, 10:08pm
If you read the item fully you will see that one officer was convicted of manslaughter in 2021 due to his part in this incident. The doubt was over the role of his young, inexperienced female colleague who claimed she was in fear at the time. I don't think that in the cool light of day her actions were always right, but I find it possible to believe that she acted with fear and confusion, and possibly even panic.
Acting out of fear when in "action". If a soldier acts out of fear isn't that called cowardice in the face of the enemy and attracts severe punishment....
I make some allowance for the fact she was an inexperienced recruit at the time. And fear for one's own life is deeply ingrained in most of us. If consumed by that fear, you could very well want to make sure that the cause of that fear was not going to get up again.
Last edited by pwa on 29 Sep 2022, 5:20am, edited 1 time in total.
pwa
Posts: 17366
Joined: 2 Oct 2011, 8:55pm

Re: Dallian Atkinson aquittal

Post by pwa »

Tangled Metal wrote: 28 Sep 2022, 10:34pm Three strikes of a baton to an incapacitated man. Size has no relevance when you're laid low on the ground by a taser. Three baton strikes is OK when your a copper who's too scared to do your job professionally. It's a hard job but if fear makes you strike a downed man are you in the right job?

Anyone like British justice? Well she's due to go under a disciplinary action. Anyone expect her to be a police officer after that? I do!
She was a probationer at the time, with next to no experience. So you could say this was the moment when she found out that she was like most of us, not suited to violent confrontations. She didn;t have what it takes. She acted out of fear. I'd say that makes her unsuited to the job.
mattheus
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Location: Western Europe

Re: Dallian Atkinson aquittal

Post by mattheus »

pwa wrote: 29 Sep 2022, 5:02am
jois wrote: 28 Sep 2022, 10:23pm
pwa wrote: 28 Sep 2022, 10:08pm
If you read the item fully you will see that one officer was convicted of manslaughter in 2021 due to his part in this incident. The doubt was over the role of his young, inexperienced female colleague who claimed she was in fear at the time. I don't think that in the cool light of day her actions were always right, but I find it possible to believe that she acted with fear and confusion, and possibly even panic.
Tha was down from a murder charge, so.....

Yea your right , bloke lay unconscious on the floor dieing, clearly any normal person would panic and give a few clouts with a metal stick. Perfectly reasonable in my opinion
That's just it though. You are expecting a young recruit who is afraid of a violent person who is much larger and stronger than her and her colleague to act with calm rationality as if she were sat at a desk in a calm atmosphere. And he wasn't necessarily unconscious at that point. She may have had reason to fear that he would get up again. I don't think she handled the situation well. I think she handled it as you and I might, terrified and driven by a desire to simply stop the threat to her own life. The jury must have bleieved that she was afraid he would get up again and possibly take her life. Add to all that the fact that her own attack on the man did not cause his death.
Sounds reasonable to me, pwa.
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