Gov't energy discount - energy company calculations

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PH
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Re: Gov't energy discount - energy company calculations

Post by PH »

Psamathe wrote: 29 Sep 2022, 10:55am I think the capped yearly bill per household is a very bad over-simplification that would confuse some.
...
(My not fully understanding was in part because I already use minimum so not a lot I can do to reduce so "it is what it is" but I did some Googling several months ago and nowwhere then could find the capped /kWh price. Things have improved recently).
Ian
I agree with both points. If they think the unit price is too complicated for people to understand, they should be putting some effort into explaining it. Not only for budgeting, if we want people to reduce consumption then understanding their usage is an essential step.
On the second point - it took ages after the cap was announced for the unit prices to be published, I don't understand the delay. I'd have thought one must have been based on the other, but given where the announcement came from, it might have just been plucked out of the air.
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simonineaston
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Re: Gov't energy discount - energy company calculations

Post by simonineaston »

but mine (British Gas) sent an email reminder to take the reading tomorrow, but I have 14 days to upload it
That's good - British Gas, owned by UK company Centrica, is coming out of this whole debacle with some modest grace. They are the only energy supplier, at least in the so-called Big Six, that have not been criticised for dealing harshly with customers in financial difficulties.
https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/publications/m ... ling-bills
S
(on the look out for Armageddon, on board a Brompton nano & ever-changing Moultons)
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simonineaston
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Re: Gov't energy discount - energy company calculations

Post by simonineaston »

If they think the unit price is too complicated for people to understand, they should be putting some effort into explaining it.
Again, I think people (in general, not aiming this comment at you, dear reader... ;-) ) are being too naive. When folks comment that bills are often hard to understand and interpret, they are missing the point. These companies have deliberately set out to make sure their dealings with customers are as opaque as possible, in order to reduce the likelihood of consumers pursuing their right to search for, and swap to, the best deal.
This is just another example of the way that large scale entrepreneurs have rigged what was supposed to be a market. It's nothing of the sort. They did the same thing with rail tickets etc. etc. that is they deliberately and cynically made sure that it's as difficult as possible for the customer to compare prices and seek the best deal.
They are playing us for fools, over & over again and the regulators that were supposed to be fighting our corner have failed, year on year, in sector after sector... we've become cash cows for big industry in a wholesale, massive scale and where a service doesn't make money, no matter how important the service, it's chucked in the bin - public libraries is a good example.
S
(on the look out for Armageddon, on board a Brompton nano & ever-changing Moultons)
PH
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Re: Gov't energy discount - energy company calculations

Post by PH »

simonineaston wrote: 29 Sep 2022, 12:48pm They are playing us for fools, over & over again and the regulators that were supposed to be fighting our corner have failed
Yes, my criticism is aimed at the regulator, I don't like what the suppliers do, but it's as I'd expect, putting the shareholders first.
hemo
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Re: Gov't energy discount - energy company calculations

Post by hemo »

The figures shell have given to me are:
E 35.314p/kwh & 42.67p sc.
G 10.295p/kwh & 28.48p sc.

Thus far since 01 Jan I have used;
E 1100 kwh & G 1453 kwh.

Using the new prices the first 8 months would be circa £800, using my current prices about £500.
With the £66/£67 rebate to be applied from Oct to March, the amount I look likely to pay will be about the same if not a tad less.
Last edited by hemo on 29 Sep 2022, 5:06pm, edited 1 time in total.
Psamathe
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Re: Gov't energy discount - energy company calculations

Post by Psamathe »

I find the Government/Truss trying to take credit for the energy discount "disappointing" as it is in reality nothing more than a delayed payment. It's coming from borrowed money that we (as taxpayers) will have to replay with (now significant) interest. So we're still paying the full amount in the long term, just through taxes or cuts to public services.

Had they got significant contributions from energy company windfall tax it would be a different matter but Truss decided the shareholders deserve the money more than those struggling to pay heating and food bulls in the face of horrendous cost of living increases.

In effect Gov. are borrowing money on our behalf for us to repay over time with interest.

Ian
hemo
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Re: Gov't energy discount - energy company calculations

Post by hemo »

A windfall tax non implimentation shows how they are only interested in the well off seeing more of the benifits of the greed.
PH
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Re: Gov't energy discount - energy company calculations

Post by PH »

Psamathe wrote: 29 Sep 2022, 5:02pm In effect Gov. are borrowing money on our behalf for us to repay over time with interest.
Ian
It's also a very blunt tool, not directed at those that need it, indeed in typical Tory fashion, those with greater consumption will get the most discount! Those repaying, in many cases the next generation, won't be paying proportionately to the benefit.
In my case, I'm a low income low user, electric supply only - My bill will have changed from £324 last year to £611 next year, that was manageable without the £400 discount, even without the revised cap next years bill would still have been under £700.
I'd hope a Labour Government would not only have imposed a windfall tax on those profiting from the higher prices (Yes I know it isn't the suppliers) but also done a better job of seeing the support went to those needing it rather than wasted on those who don't.
Nearholmer
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Re: Gov't energy discount - energy company calculations

Post by Nearholmer »

the regulators that were supposed to be fighting our corner have failed, year on year, in sector after sector..
Ofgem spectacularly so. The National Audit Office have said as much in writing, let alone consumers rightfully moaning about it all.
rmurphy195
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Re: Gov't energy discount - energy company calculations

Post by rmurphy195 »

hemo wrote: 29 Sep 2022, 4:56pm The figures shell have given to me are:
E 35.314p/kwh & 42.67p sc.
G 10.295p/kwh & 28.48p sc.

Thus far since 01 Jan I have used;
E 1100 kwh & G 1453 kwh.

Using the new prices the first 8 months would be circa £800, using my current prices about £500.
With the £66/£67 rebate to be applied from Oct to March, the amount I look likely to pay will be about the same if not a tad less.
Thanks Hemo, does Shell give the Government’s Energy Price Guarantee discount amount? (my British Gas document does)
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""You know you're getting old when it's easier to ride a bike than to get on and off it" - quote from observant jogger !
Psamathe
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Re: Gov't energy discount - energy company calculations

Post by Psamathe »

I has a really daft experience today. I got a letter from my electricity provider with my new rates under the Gov. discount Scheme. And it said "You can save £29-84 if you switch to PAYG". Being unconvinced I called them and they said "Um, I'll check ..." then "switching to PAYG will cost you £40+ a year more". Prices since the letter have not changed, my meter reading have noy changed so why tell me one thing in a letter which is totally wrong!

I didn't kick-up a fuss as I already have a formal complaint with them about their passing my details to a 3rd party without my permission.

Ian
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al_yrpal
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Re: Gov't energy discount - energy company calculations

Post by al_yrpal »

I kept last years energy bills and can see clearly how much we were using and can see that we can easily save about 5000 kwh pa of gas. I also know our overall consumption figures for a year and by calculating prices per kwh and standing charges provided by our supplier Utility Warehouse its easy to calculate an annual energy charge.

Then...take off government subsidies...

£400 rebate
£150 council rebate
£200 pensioner energy rebate
£300 special pensioner energy rebate
Total - £1050

Divide by 12 to get monthly spend.

My one remaining question is "what happens 2023/2024?

Al
Last edited by al_yrpal on 30 Sep 2022, 10:01am, edited 1 time in total.
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Jdsk
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Re: Gov't energy discount - energy company calculations

Post by Jdsk »

al_yrpal wrote: 30 Sep 2022, 9:36am ...
My one remaining question is "what happens 2022/2023?
Jdsk wrote: 25 Sep 2022, 5:52pm
al_yrpal wrote: 25 Sep 2022, 5:46pm One thing hasnt been made clear - this winter we are getting £400 off our bills.....what about next winter, will we still get that, or, are they waiting to see if gas prices come down?
The official statement is now:

GOV.UK: "Energy bills support factsheet":
https://www.gov.uk/government/publicati ... ember-2022
Updated 21 September 2022

To the best of my knowledge beyond that it's politics. And not necessarily the same across the UK.
Jonathan
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simonineaston
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Re: Gov't energy discount - energy company calculations

Post by simonineaston »

I'm thinking there may not be a next winter - well, not for us humans anyway... Putin's about to annexe 4 districts from Ukraine, which as I understand it, is a so-called red line for Nato. Oh Dear. The End is Nigh !!
Anyway, meanwhile if you're stuck for light entertainment, read up about former Soviet army lieutenant colonel, Stanislav Petrov, who having used his experience & judgement to save the world from nuclear armagedon, was scorned and spurned by the authorities... some people just don't appreciate the resources they've got, do they ?!
S
(on the look out for Armageddon, on board a Brompton nano & ever-changing Moultons)
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al_yrpal
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Re: Gov't energy discount - energy company calculations

Post by al_yrpal »

Sorry for my typo, I meant 2023/2024 ie next winter. Will the same subsidies apply? I guess its a wait a see on the Govts part?

Al
Reuse, recycle, thus do your bit to save the planet.... Get stuff at auctions, Dump, Charity Shops, Facebook Marketplace, Ebay, Car Boots. Choose an Old House, and a Banger ..... And cycle as often as you can......
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