Cycle lights blinding oncoming drivers

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Jdsk
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Re: Cycle lights blinding oncoming drivers

Post by Jdsk »

freiston wrote: 12 Nov 2022, 5:51pm
Jdsk wrote: 12 Nov 2022, 5:32pm I don't understand some of the terms.

Will all of my recent B+M dynamo-driven headlamps comply with "StVZO"?

Thanks

Jonathan
Why do I feel that that's a leading question? As far as I'm aware, all of B+M dynamo-driven headlamps comply with "StVZO" design/function requirements though I do believe that to fully comply in use (where compliance is a requirement), the beam has to be angled/aimed to particular measurements so as to follow the requirement of the StVZO regulations. iirc, the leaflet that comes with the B+M lights tells you how to aim them.
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PH
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Re: Cycle lights blinding oncoming drivers

Post by PH »

Jdsk wrote: 12 Nov 2022, 5:32pm Will all of my recent B+M dynamo-driven headlamps comply with "StVZO"?
Thanks
Jonathan
Yes, they'd be pretty much unsellable in their major markets if they weren't.
The opposite isn't true, that all non StVZO will be blinders, features other than beam shape may exclude them, or the manufactures may consider their main markets don't require it.
Jdsk
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Re: Cycle lights blinding oncoming drivers

Post by Jdsk »

Thankyou

Jonathan
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mjr
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Re: Cycle lights blinding oncoming drivers

Post by mjr »

A StVZO light should have K~ followed by numbers stamped or moulded on it somewhere. You can look up the number somewhere online (to check it matches the light model) but I forget where.
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Jdsk
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Re: Cycle lights blinding oncoming drivers

Post by Jdsk »

Thankyou.

I'll have a look.

Jonathan
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Cowsham
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Re: Cycle lights blinding oncoming drivers

Post by Cowsham »

Hmm -- after this mornings incident while commuting to work I'll keep my light pointing straight down the road and on semi blink mode.

On my way to work this morning on a dark country road but approaching the town where I work so traffic starting to get slightly busier. Still pitch dark so had my cateye 400 on full gizzy.

A big Jeep appears to slow down to stop at a T junction I'm approaching on my side of the road. There's an oncoming car on the road and we are all approaching the junction at the same time.

But the Jeep driver doesn't stop and just drives on out. I pulled on the brakes -- bike does a bit of a slide with rear stepping out to the left leaving the front of the bike pointing towards the oncoming car me along side the Jeep drivers side window and now shouting at the driver, my headlight lighting up his stupid face but he still drives on!

When the Jeep had just missed me cos of my avoiding action I thought that was close until the 4 wheeled trailer he was towing just brushed my trouser leg!

He drove on but giving me a flash of the indicators while the oncoming driver seeing the whole incident was tooting his horn -- in some way think he was checking I was OK.

The Jeep driver pulled in at what seemed to be his farm / workplace or whatever a few hundred yards on down the road -- I stopped with him to let him know what he'd just done and how I'd managed to avoid a terrible incident.

He admitted he hadn't seen me -- I said " so you didn't see this beam of light shining at the side of your face ?" Pointing to my still lit cateye " and me in full high vis ?"

I told him "you didn't look to your right at all " and he again admitted he didn't look right before exiting the junction -- then I told him about the trailer wheels brushing my leg. I think he got the picture -- he seemed contrite and apologetic but I said " why didn't you stop to check if I was OK?" He had no answer only to say he was completely in the wrong there and completely to blame.

I told him we were both very lucky boys cos it could've been a life changing event for both of us. ie one of my sons would've taken care of him, but not in a Florence Nightingale kind of way. ( I'd have needed Florence for a while probably )
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awavey
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Re: Cycle lights blinding oncoming drivers

Post by awavey »

but I always think its the wrong takeaway from incidents like that, that the driver didnt see you because of a lack of illumination in their direction.

Ive had a few close calls myself recently now its dark on the commute home with cars pulling out in front of me like I wasnt there at all, including a police car {FFE - family-friendly edit }, and you always get the drivers saying SMIDSY, and you think well how can that be there are street lights, Im wearing bright coloured jackets, Im visible,so it must be my lights arent bright enough or pointing at them enough to be seen right, that seems reasonable to conclude doesnt it ?

and I even went to the lengths of testing my light setup in the dark, which actually just confirmed my lights were plenty bright enough to be seen from far enough away

the actual issue Ive been getting is the drivers just arent looking properly either because theyre distracted or in a hurry, or trying to get ahead of a queue, they arent looking for a cyclist regardless of how bright my light might be, theyre looking for something car shaped, so a roof, or a windscreen, something thats big and wide, its not the lights, and when their brain doesnt see something that looks car shaped, they think hey its clear carry on, and more often than not simply dont even pause to stop at the junction to check its clear, they just pile on through, at which point you're quite often toast because of it, followed by the driver saying "I just didnt see you" and we go round the loop again about but it must be the lights..

but its exactly like the time I was witness to a collision when a SUV driver t-boned a cyclist who was already on a roundabout, he had lights I could see from at least half a mile away behind him, but the SUV driver who approached this roundabout 90 degrees to the direction the cyclist was going, simply wasnt approaching it like a I need to stop, check its properly clear first then proceed, it was one of those approaching in motion checks of oh cant see a car, it must be clear accelerate, oh where did this cyclist who is now a hood ornament on my vehicle come from. Literally the first thing the driver said to me after we'd all stopped when I went to speak to him was "I didnt see the cyclist", and I did reply back he was there to be seen, I saw him, Id a feeling the driver was on his phone as well but I had no proof, it was just a hunch.
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Re: Cycle lights blinding oncoming drivers

Post by arnsider »

The last time I rode any distance after dark, I travelled south on the A 483 from Llandrindod Wells for a couple of miles, turning right and down an unlit C road to Disserth. I used a cheap and reliable rechargeable Lezyne headlamp that is good enough for dark country lanes and more than adequate for trunk roads, lit or unlit.
These expensive high spec high powered headlamps are little more than a Dick Measuring contest. They are far too bright for normal trunk roads and only come into their own on-lanes or Off-road.
Spend your cash on a good High Viz jacket!
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Cowsham
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Re: Cycle lights blinding oncoming drivers

Post by Cowsham »

I think if cycling in traffic you need your lamp on full blink in daylight and semi blink at night ( so you can see the road in pitch dark which I usually am in the winter months )

During the above incident the lamp was just on full beam so with so many other lights like spotlights ( *illegally ) shining out of people's property blinding road users he could've mistaken my light for one of them since I wasn't moving particularly fast ie about 10 or 12 MPH cos I was early that morning and had decided to slow down a bit so the cold wind wouldn't penetrate as far and I was getting near work.

I was wearing high vis as stated above but my full beam would've been all the driver would've seen. ( if he'd looked properly )

If blink mode of some sort is used I think drivers will notice it more -- I know as a driver I notice them more. Failing that it's a flashing blue beacon I need on the top of my crash hat.


( *it's an offence in NI not sure about mainland -- my brother had to write government warning of prosecution letters to a hotel owner recently who's sign was getting complaints from dazzled drivers )
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roubaixtuesday
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Re: Cycle lights blinding oncoming drivers

Post by roubaixtuesday »

I commute on unlit back lanes every day.

It's unfortunate, but in my experience your lights are either
(1) not bright enough to inconvenience oncoming traffic, in which case a good proportion leave their full beam on, blinding you or
(2) bright enough to inconvenience oncoming traffic, in which case a small proportion shout at you and complain. but they pretty much all dip their lights.

It's a no win.

I try to compromise by having a very bright light, but putting my gloves in front of it to dim it once the car as turned off their beam. If they don't turn off their beam I use my hand to flash the light, which pretty much guarantees a reaction. On wide or urban roads I use a lower setting.

A fair few cyclists have very bright lights on flashing mode on back lanes. i don't know how they can stand the constant strobe in front of them!
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Re: Cycle lights blinding oncoming drivers

Post by PH »

roubaixtuesday wrote: 1 Dec 2022, 9:36am It's unfortunate, but in my experience your lights are either
(1) not bright enough to inconvenience oncoming traffic, in which case a good proportion leave their full beam on, blinding you or
(2) bright enough to inconvenience oncoming traffic, in which case a small proportion shout at you and complain. but they pretty much all dip their lights.

It's a no win.
That might have been true a few years ago, but is no longer so. There's a good and growing choice of bike lights that have the equivalent of a dipped beam, some with a switchable high beam.
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Re: Cycle lights blinding oncoming drivers

Post by mattheus »

PH wrote: 1 Dec 2022, 10:31am
roubaixtuesday wrote: 1 Dec 2022, 9:36am It's unfortunate, but in my experience your lights are either
(1) not bright enough to inconvenience oncoming traffic, in which case a good proportion leave their full beam on, blinding you or
(2) bright enough to inconvenience oncoming traffic, in which case a small proportion shout at you and complain. but they pretty much all dip their lights.

It's a no win.
That might have been true a few years ago, but is no longer so. There's a good and growing choice of bike lights that have the equivalent of a dipped beam, some with a switchable high beam.
Yup. Not just for dyno-users now!
roubaixtuesday wrote: 1 Dec 2022, 9:36am A fair few cyclists have very bright lights on flashing mode on back lanes. i don't know how they can stand the constant strobe in front of them!
Me neither - especially the ones who have no other front light!!!
(I saw a guy riding the whole Mersey24h like that - it drove ME mad roughly hourly, let alone him ...
thirdcrank
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Re: Cycle lights blinding oncoming drivers

Post by thirdcrank »

I appreciate that this isn't the main topic, but I think a large part of the problem with dazzle from motor vehicle headlamps is caused by a total lack of standardisation of "minor" controls like those for adjusting headlights when eg a car with a single occupant picks up four passengers and a load of luggage. In a perfect world, everybody knows all the controls, but in reality, they may not, and that's not helped by the relevant controls often being hidden under the dash at knee height.
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Cowsham
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Re: Cycle lights blinding oncoming drivers

Post by Cowsham »

It's not car Headlamps blinding cyclists it's the other way round -- ours dazzling the car drivers but that incident the other morning made me reassess the situation. A full blink mode yes would drive me insane but I've come to the conclusion a semi blink especially at night is what I'm going to try. Don't like it but that's one of the downsides of riding at night I'll just have to accept.
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Pebble
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Re: Cycle lights blinding oncoming drivers

Post by Pebble »

As a driver I can't ever recall ever being even remotely dazzled by someone on a push bike. But as a cyclist (who regularly rides in the dark) I am repeatedly blinded by cars and trucks. Many people don't even dip their lights for cyclists, whether that is because they don't think cyclists are worthy of the effort, or may be it is because they have the modern auto ones (adaptive main beam assist) and that tech does not always recognise cyclists.?

And even the ones that do dip, the high intensity dip beam can be temporarily too high or flickering on on even road surfaces, and can impede my night vision for a few tens of yards.
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