Who checks their bike before a ride?

[Nearholmer]

it's a very expensive hobby/fetish imo.

I tend to agree. The weight saving over good steel isn’t huge once considered among all the other weights, those of rider, wheels, drivetrain etc, maybe something like 1kg in 85-100kg, but good titanium is still a lot more expensive than good steel.

I guess if you are deeply into weight-saving, and I know some people really pursue every last gram, it might be worth it to you, but personally, I’m not, and if I was would probably look first to my own waist, where I could lose weight and save money, by eating less.

[Cugel]

it's a very expensive hobby/fetish imo.

I tend to agree. The weight saving over good steel isn’t huge once considered among all the other weights, those of rider, wheels, drivetrain etc, maybe something like 1kg in 85-100kg, but good titanium is still a lot more expensive than good steel.

I guess if you are deeply into weight-saving, and I know some people really pursue every last gram, it might be worth it to you, but personally, I’m not, and if I was would probably look first to my own waist, where I could lose weight and save money, by eating less.

The weight saving thing. Generated by the dominance of racing cyclist culture in Britain with all that stuff about marginal gains and the like, along with older foo-fah generated from hill-climbing championships, where everything was once drilled so much to lower the weight by 3 gms that the bicycle often crumbled before it reached the finish line!

There have been various marketing gushes based on new wonder materials, especially metals - magnesium and beryllium, even! More cracking, crumbling and so forth.

However, resin-enshrouded carbon fibre has proved the exception. It really is a rather superior material for making many things, particularly bike frames and wheel rims (for disc-braked wheels at least). Having ridden many bikes over the decades, I'll opine that the CF items have a significant, notable and very evident advantage over other materials in cycling manufacture - if the design and construction techniques used are appropriate and done well. But then proper design and construction applies to any material, eh?

I've bent and broken steel frames. Aluminium frames have, after a lot of years and use, shown the odd bit of aging (some corrosion). The six carbon fibre frames we have in the hoose still seem as good as new - although the oldest in but ten and a half years old. So responsive, comfortable and quick, though.

Cugel

[Biospace]

However, resin-enshrouded carbon fibre has proved the exception. It really is a rather superior material for making many things, particularly bike frames and wheel rims (for disc-braked wheels at least).
Cugel

Just a shame that while wonderful for engineering things, when its effect on our eco-system is considered, it's not quite as wonderful.

https://www.theguardian.com/sustainable ... rty-secret

[Cugel]

However, resin-enshrouded carbon fibre has proved the exception. It really is a rather superior material for making many things, particularly bike frames and wheel rims (for disc-braked wheels at least).
Cugel

Just a shame that while wonderful for engineering things, when its effect on our eco-system is considered, it's not quite as wonderful.

https://www.theguardian.com/sustainable ... rty-secret

Is that so? Have you the comparative figures for CF items and those made of various metals? Now, I would like the full fat equations please, inclusive of all the pre-manufacturing pollutions (from mining, smelting etc.) as well as those for the manufacturing processes; then the usage pollutions followed by the pollutions from the post-use when it all becomes "rubbish". Any recycling (actual and potential, or lack of them) should also be included perhaps.

Cugel

[francovendee]

I never used to but after an incident when someone thought it fun to slacken of both QR skewers when it was left outside the local bar.

[pwa]

I've come a cropper three times on account of bike/materials failure in my life. Mercifully none of them have caused me much physical damage, but the bikes in each case have written off. In entirety.

There are only a few things that you absolutely can't mitigate against while cycling: other poor road users, personal errors or intoxication, and catastrophic mechanical failure. It's the latter that worries me most.

The more robust your bike, the less you have to worry about. My current ready-to-go bike is a titanium framed tourer with strong cro-mo forks and 36 spoke wheels with middle weight rims, so serious crash-inducing materials failure is unlikely. I could still crack a saddle rail, of course, or a handlebar. That's one to watch, certainly. I've had a couple of ally seatpins go, but they both went with a kind of sag that gave me time to process what was going on and stand up.

I must admit I wouldn't touch a titanium frame with a barge pole. Our lbs has a walk in cupboard filled with broken and unrepairable frames. I regularly have a look in to see if there are any headsets or parts I can scavenge. About a third of them are aluminium, there are a few Carbon frames and forks, but the rest are Ti. Including a lovely, and very expensive Bianchi which has a visible crack right around the downtube where it meets the head tube. Luckily it was still warrantied. There are only two steel frames, both of which are bottom bracket fails.

Welding Titanium is extraordinary difficult, and with seemingly a new Chinese Ti frames coming out every week, joint falls are only set to increase. eBay appears to be flooded with Titanium these days. Fortunately they rarely seem to fail catastrophically, but it's a very expensive hobby/fetish imo.

My two titanium frame purchases have both done lots of miles over a good few years and look as new as the day I first got them. Unlike the expensive steel frames they replaced, which have long since gone to meet their maker, having suffered from recurring rust that started around the cable ends on the top tube. Steel is unsustainable for me. The bloke at Argos Racing Cycles I spoke to about the rust problem said that I was probably endowed with particualrly corrosive sweat that drips onto the paint immediately below my face and softens the enamel paint. He told me that as I was wasting a few hundred quid more on yet another a new paint job that would last a couple of years or so before the rust returned. For me, I'm afraid, steel is not a realistic option. My "hobby/fetish", as you put it, is an attempt to get something that will last ten years or more without making me cringe every time I look at it and see a blister of paint developing.

I know some people are unlucky with titanium. So far it looks like I've got a couple of good ones. But I'd rather risk the chance of a crack than the certainty of rust. And for me that rust on steel is a certainty. Enamel, powder coat, makes no difference.

[pwa]

it's a very expensive hobby/fetish imo.

I tend to agree. The weight saving over good steel isn’t huge once considered among all the other weights, those of rider, wheels, drivetrain etc, maybe something like 1kg in 85-100kg, but good titanium is still a lot more expensive than good steel.

I guess if you are deeply into weight-saving, and I know some people really pursue every last gram, it might be worth it to you, but personally, I’m not, and if I was would probably look first to my own waist, where I could lose weight and save money, by eating less.

As mentioned above, I'm into saving on rust, not weight. I'd happily settle on steel if it were not for the rust problems I had with steel over many years. I have scrapped frames made from Columbus Nivacrom steel, Reynolds 725 steel (x2) and Reynolds 531ST, all when the rust reached a point where careful touching up would no longer be enough and yet another new coat of paint was required, along with new cable stops. I still have a corroding Thorn tandem under a sheet in the back of the garage. For me, enough was enough. And I didn't want carbon because (personal aesthetic thing) it looks cheap without being cheap, and it is basically carbon encased in plastic and is ultimately landfill that will never break down. I ride bikes for pleasure, and part of the pleasure is from how I feel about them.

[peetee]

I had ridden steel almost exclusively for all my cycling life. I had never wanted for or enjoyed anything else. On the contrary, I had a magnesium frame which was dreadfully bendy and an aluminium frame that would have knocked my fillings out; if I had any.
I was halfway to designing and ordering a custom steel frame for everyday use when a Van Nicholas titanium bike popped up on the local freeads. The frame was two years old and had one thousand miles under its dropouts. It was specced with Ultegra triple which is exactly the sort of components I would have chosen for my build. The icing on the cake was it having been maintained by a local mechanic who I trust implicitly and has serviced and finished the bike just as I like to see customers bikes leave my workshop.
When the seller dropped the price from £1000 to £550 I was right in there and am very happy with the purchase.

[Biospace]

However, resin-enshrouded carbon fibre has proved the exception. It really is a rather superior material for making many things, particularly bike frames and wheel rims (for disc-braked wheels at least).
Cugel

Just a shame that while wonderful for engineering things, when its effect on our eco-system is considered, it's not quite as wonderful.

https://www.theguardian.com/sustainable ... rty-secret

Is that so? Have you the comparative figures for CF items and those made of various metals? Now, I would like the full fat equations please, inclusive of all the pre-manufacturing pollutions (from mining, smelting etc.) as well as those for the manufacturing processes; then the usage pollutions followed by the pollutions from the post-use when it all becomes "rubbish". Any recycling (actual and potential, or lack of them) should also be included perhaps.

Cugel

Everything I read suggests a very small percentage of carbon fibre is recycled and it's as hard on the environmental in its manufacture as steel. And not just in the Guardian, but I'm eager to learn this is not the case as its properties are so wonderful.

Haven't time to write the half-dissertation as you request. If you know the real facts, please enlighten us all.

[Dingdong]

Just a shame that while wonderful for engineering things, when its effect on our eco-system is considered, it's not quite as wonderful.

https://www.theguardian.com/sustainable ... rty-secret

Is that so? Have you the comparative figures for CF items and those made of various metals? Now, I would like the full fat equations please, inclusive of all the pre-manufacturing pollutions (from mining, smelting etc.) as well as those for the manufacturing processes; then the usage pollutions followed by the pollutions from the post-use when it all becomes "rubbish". Any recycling (actual and potential, or lack of them) should also be included perhaps.

Cugel

Everything I read suggests a very small percentage of carbon fibre is recycled and it's as hard on the environmental in its manufacture as steel. And not just in the Guardian, but I'm eager to learn this is not the case as its properties are so wonderful.

Haven't time to write the half-dissertation as you request. If you know the real facts, please enlighten us all.

As someone who has pretty much tried and tested most frame materials, I can honestly say my preference is for steel, and latterly I'm quite taken with carbon fibre. My current squeeze, an 8.5kg gravel bike is roughly half the weight of the cyclo cross monster I used to race back in the day!

[Biospace]

Is that so? Have you the comparative figures for CF items and those made of various metals? Now, I would like the full fat equations please, inclusive of all the pre-manufacturing pollutions (from mining, smelting etc.) as well as those for the manufacturing processes; then the usage pollutions followed by the pollutions from the post-use when it all becomes "rubbish". Any recycling (actual and potential, or lack of them) should also be included perhaps.

Cugel

Everything I read suggests a very small percentage of carbon fibre is recycled and it's as hard on the environmental in its manufacture as steel. And not just in the Guardian, but I'm eager to learn this is not the case as its properties are so wonderful.

Haven't time to write the half-dissertation as you request. If you know the real facts, please enlighten us all.

As someone who has pretty much tried and tested most frame materials, I can honestly say my preference is for steel, and latterly I'm quite taken with carbon fibre. My current squeeze, an 8.5kg gravel bike is roughly half the weight of the cyclo cross monster I used to race back in the day!

Yes, that's about where I am. There's not much I haven't given chance to impress but time and again steel shines through for so many reasons, with carbon fibre the material which would be saved for the big spends.

[Dingdong]

I tend to buy second hand steel frames, a bit like analogue photography you can get some great deals from a 'vintage' technology. I rarely buy new, it has to be really something special to test my wallet!

[Cugel]

Just a shame that while wonderful for engineering things, when its effect on our eco-system is considered, it's not quite as wonderful.

https://www.theguardian.com/sustainable ... rty-secret

Is that so? Have you the comparative figures for CF items and those made of various metals? Now, I would like the full fat equations please, inclusive of all the pre-manufacturing pollutions (from mining, smelting etc.) as well as those for the manufacturing processes; then the usage pollutions followed by the pollutions from the post-use when it all becomes "rubbish". Any recycling (actual and potential, or lack of them) should also be included perhaps.

Cugel

Everything I read suggests a very small percentage of carbon fibre is recycled and it's as hard on the environmental in its manufacture as steel. And not just in the Guardian, but I'm eager to learn this is not the case as its properties are so wonderful.

Haven't time to write the half-dissertation as you request. If you know the real facts, please enlighten us all.

Sadly I remain ignorant of the environmental impacts and costs of many things, including carbon fibre & resin constructions. The stuff seems very stable, though, which it needs to be for bike frames and other engineered components coming under huge stresses and strains, so presumably it could be stored easily when done with, without leaching bad stuff into the environment .... ? (That's a guess). But could it be processed for reuse?

Hopefully there'll be an engineer somewhere who can inform us all.

Cugel

[Cugel]

I tend to buy second hand steel frames, a bit like analogue photography you can get some great deals from a 'vintage' technology. I rarely buy new, it has to be really something special to test my wallet!

Film-based photography. Now there's an old technology that needs doing away with forever & ever.

As a yoof, I spent too much time and money, risking my health to boot, in a dark room. What a tedious, expensive and disappointing procedure compared to digital photography. Also, extremely limiting in what could be achieved compared with the abilities of Photoshop and other such image-handling software.

I rid myself of the film photography gubbins I had collected over the years a long time since. I now have 1000X the photos per year I ever got out of film; at a greatly reduced cost; and without all that chemical cack; and of a far higher quality, both technically and in terms of their composition (due to the opportunity to practice without the high unit cost of doing so with film). I would never go back and tend to give a sceptical chortle when film fans wax lyrical about the "special qualities" of film. Have they not heard of the software profiles that emulate every film-look there's ever been, using Photoshop?

Cugel

[pwa]

As far as I am aware, carbon fibre components are basically beyond recycling because of their composite nature, just like the glass fibre bodies of Trabants and Reliant Robins. Once finished with, they will be around for thousands of years, probably buried with other rubbish. That may not be a top priority problem, but it doesn't help me to love that material when the metal alternatives are to some degree recylcable. But I don't doubt its performance advantages, and I don't expect carbon fibre to pollute unless the resin degrades and produces microscopic particles. I don't know if that is likely.

Getting closer to the original topic, I think I instinctively carry out basic bike function tests as soon as I set off on a bike. A run through the gears, a squeeze of the brakes, and a quick assessment of whether the tyres feel to be at the right pressure. If anything feels or sounds not quite right, I pull over and have an inspection.