Decided to install mudguards.

General cycling advice ( NOT technical ! )
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531colin
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Re: Decided to install mudguards.

Post by 531colin »

Jupestar wrote: 21 Nov 2022, 10:09pm ...........
531colin wrote: 21 Nov 2022, 12:05pm SKS breakaways to be 100% at preventing this happening
Is this the black brackets which fit to the fork with the stays in? .............
Yeah, these things that the end of the stay plugs into....https://www.spacycles.co.uk/m19b0s190p3 ... m-%28pr%29
Found some more stuff.....https://www.cyclinguk.org/article/techn ... ard-safety
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531colin
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Re: Decided to install mudguards.

Post by 531colin »

blimey, can you cut mudguard stays with those? ....don't shake my hand!

I have to use both hands and something like these.... https://www.screwfix.com/p/bolt-cutters-18-457mm/7759v

the cut ends fly and ping around like stray bullets in the cowboy films
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Cowsham
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Re: Decided to install mudguards.

Post by Cowsham »

531colin wrote: 22 Nov 2022, 10:28pm
blimey, can you cut mudguard stays with those?
Absolutely -- my hands aren't strong at all -- I get the wife to open jam jars.

Wouldn't be bothered with the bolt cutters -- the wire cutters are the ideal tool for the job -- they are designed to but 3mm galvanized wire -- the cut bits do still fly like .... but you can grab the stay with one hand and cut with the other.

I can have a set of new lifeline mudguards on in minuits. They're very easy to fit and the ends of the stays are fixed inside the gland that clips onto the mudguards so there's no chance you'll get skewered by one ie the stays don't protrude out beyond the guard like in the old days.
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Jupestar
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Re: Decided to install mudguards.

Post by Jupestar »

Not got round to this yet, riding only with the back one on. but i do have a plan now, just need the time!
Cowsham wrote: 22 Nov 2022, 12:36am Here's the link

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Draper-Expert- ... th=1&psc=1
I have a set of these, can't imagine them getting through the stays.. I'll take you word for it.

Hacksaw seems a bit fiddly. Would have to mark it remove and refit...

I'll probably get the angle grinder out.
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Cowsham
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Re: Decided to install mudguards.

Post by Cowsham »

If they cut through paling wire they'll cut a stay -- I've used them for all the families bikes but watch your eyes for bullets. I just offered it up -- marked it with a sharpy and then you can put it down on the floor and press down on one handle of the pliers if you don't have the grip but I found it fairly easy.

You've huge mechanical advantage with these pliers -- I've cut Galv lashing wire with one hand too -- much thicker than paling wire but multi stranded ( about 5mm diameter )
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Cowsham
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Re: Decided to install mudguards.

Post by Cowsham »

If you have pliers with a wire shear hole then they are ideal but they're about twice as expensive as the mudguards.
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keyboardmonkey
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Re: Decided to install mudguards.

Post by keyboardmonkey »

I have Knipex wire rope cutters in a similar design to the Draper ones listed above. Personally, I would prefer to keep them for cutting gear housing rather than bolts. For that purpose I have rather compact bolt cutters, although I might have bought those 18” ones from Screwfix linked to by 531colin if I had seen them earlier; they are quite a bit cheaper than the ones I have and look rather serious.

Anyway, my simple and effective method of avoiding the cut ends of mudguard stays pinging around the garage is to tape the uncut ends together then run a perpendicular length of tape along the mudguard.

A02D0A44-87E0-4EB3-BEBC-81AC5BCA94CB.jpeg
9708CCB0-0595-4C13-8FC4-4175C2978D06.jpeg

(Before that I used to drape that perforated matting/toolbox liner stuff over the mudguard and stay end. You can still see to cut, but ultimately I chose not to risk the cut end flying through the matting.)
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Cowsham
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Re: Decided to install mudguards.

Post by Cowsham »

Problem with that style of mudguard is the exposed ends of the cut stays. The lifeline ones don't have that problem.
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keyboardmonkey
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Re: Decided to install mudguards.

Post by keyboardmonkey »

Cowsham wrote: 25 Nov 2022, 8:56am Problem with that style of mudguard is the exposed ends of the cut stays. The lifeline ones don't have that problem.
There really is no problem:

SKS Longboards 11068 *new version*
SKS Longboards 11068 *new version*

I have a pair of mudguards similar to the Lifeline ones. I’m not a fan, but that’s probably in part my fault because it seems likely I cut too much off the stay ends. They do their job of popping out from time to time, but not so far in any sort of emergency.
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Cowsham
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Re: Decided to install mudguards.

Post by Cowsham »

keyboardmonkey wrote: 25 Nov 2022, 9:26am
Cowsham wrote: 25 Nov 2022, 8:56am Problem with that style of mudguard is the exposed ends of the cut stays. The lifeline ones don't have that problem.
There really is no problem:


3E0406F5-DB22-41B6-BD27-CA83E33238BA.jpeg


I have a pair of mudguards similar to the Lifeline ones. I’m not a fan, but that’s probably in part my fault because it seems likely I cut too much off the stay ends. They do their job of popping out from time to time, but not so far in any sort of emergency.

Ah -- that's a better idea.
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slowster
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Re: Decided to install mudguards.

Post by slowster »

If using a significantly narrower mudguard than the general recommendation of 10mm wider than the tyre, I think the Lifeline design will have an advantage over SKS/Bluemels in that the bracket hardware of the latter is closer to the sides of the tyre, and only a little movement is needed for the bracket hardware to make contact with the tyre. SKS Secuclips allow more side to side movement of the stays, which exacerbates this. In contrast, the bracket hardware of the Lifeline mudguards is well away from the sides of the tyre.

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Ray
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Re: Decided to install mudguards.

Post by Ray »

I've never used the Lifeline 'guards, but they do look neater than the SKS, and may be a bit quicker to fit; not that this is a job that needs to be done more than once or twice in several years!

The outstanding quality of the SKS, for me, is the toughness and resilience of the laminated material they are made from, esp. when compared to the brittle plastic of the Bluemels we used bitd. Mudguards lead a tough life. How well do the Lifeline 'guards stand up to years of use/abuse?
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Cowsham
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Re: Decided to install mudguards.

Post by Cowsham »

I have had the lifeline ones on 4 of our bikes for 3 years now and no stays have come adrift and the plastic seems very tough and not at all brittle.

Actually that bad smash I had off the mountain bike last year ( well documented here ) was due to me getting too close to the young boys bike and when he braked for the pothole the front of my bike got levered over the rear mudguard of his bike hence my bike flicked upside down so the weight of the front of my bike was carried by his rear mudguard. There is a mark on it where my bike pivoted over it but no real damage -- didn't even need adjusted after.
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freiston
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Re: Decided to install mudguards.

Post by freiston »

Cowsham wrote: 25 Nov 2022, 8:56am Problem with that style of mudguard is the exposed ends of the cut stays. The lifeline ones don't have that problem.
I have a feint scar that is now over 40 years old, running down my shin from when I was fitting a pair of ESGE chromoplastics but needed to be out for work (errands boy) before finishing the job, so I left the stays untrimmed, to do later. On arriving at work, I dismounted and scraped my leg. Didn't think much of it until my boss pointed out the pool of blood forming on the floor next to my foot.

The last two pairs of SKS mudguards that I fitted (both this century), the stays were very tough and I ended up cutting them with a hacksaw, stays in a vice - about the toughest steel I've ever cut, I reckon. I have some Draper wire cutters that I use for cables - I wouldn't dare try them on mudguard stays in fear of ruining them. If I ever have the job of fitting mudguards again, I'll invest in a pair of those little bolt croppers that 531colin linked to.

I've had Secuclips break away once - when doing less than 10 mph through a churchyard in autumn - a short thick twig buried under the leaves got scooped up by my Longboard mudflap - I popped the stays back into the clips and carried on. Glad I had them.
Disclaimer: Treat what I say with caution and if possible, wait for someone with more knowledge and experience to contribute. ;)
LancsGirl
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Re: Decided to install mudguards.

Post by LancsGirl »

531colin wrote: 21 Nov 2022, 12:05pm
So far, I have found the SKS breakaways to be 100% at preventing this happening....the breakaways release with a considerable clatter and almost all the time whatever got stuck in the first place drops out never to be found....I have had an exception once (off road) when a stick got caught in the spokes and the guard folded up before the stays released; the guard came up alongside the down tube and I could only steer one way, and as I was on grazing land I went round in a circle until I fell off ....I suppose if you had the presence of mind (or panic) you could force the steering. Other than that time, I just put the breakaways back and carry on....I guess they release maybe once a year, on tracks.
My emphasis.

Sorry to sound like a pedant, but with respect, that's not 100% then, is it?

You've remembered the single exception, as most of us would. How many times have they worked, as intended? It would be interesting to know the proportion.
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