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exactly my thoughts Horizon (have read some epic accounts of days and days across frozen wastes - sounds like misery to me - always suspect folks into those trips are working out some childhood trauma or a penance trip) - will be North Downs, Surrey Hills or maybe Bowland fells.
Actually, with the right kit and suitable weather it's the bee's knees... (here's my missus, ski touring in Norway)
I have a silk liner and a synthetic one. I'm not sure whether the synthetic one is nylon or polyester or what (except that it's orange, which in itself is not IMO a good colour for something to sleep in!). I'm not convinced that either adds a huge amount of insulation, but whereas the synthetic one tends to feel cold on first getting and then gets clammy and sweaty during the night – it doesn't breathe much – the silk one tends to feel warmer against the skin and breathes reasonably well. It's also lighter and packs smaller. So from that pov, I'd recommend a silk liner over a synthetic one. Never tried a wool liner mind...pjclinch wrote: ↑28 Nov 2022, 10:04am Silk liners tend to be over-rated for their thermal effect. A liner will generally keep you warm to a similar degree as PJs made from the same thing, so unless it's pretty thick silk (which is available, but bag liners tend to be quite fine silk) it won't make a huge difference. Various synthetic and wool thermal liners are available. Most silk liners are primarily about keeping the bag clean rather than the occupant toasty.
Pete.
Yup, VBLs are the things. Never been in the business of needing one, thankfully! As I understand it these are the things for polar expedition work and the like. I once saw a film of some incredibly stoic Russians skiing to the North Pole and the first thing they got to do on pitching camp was smash the balls of ice that had formed in their sleeping bags from the damp in them, so maybe they hadn't taken VBLs? Whole thing was somewhere on the wrong side of Type 2 Fun, whatever
My usual Weapon of Choice is a JagBags silk one so clearly I'm on board with silk being a Good Thing, but I'd suggest sweeping all synthetic fabrics in to one pot is a bit, well, sweeping. There's a huge range of synthetic fabrics available and they differ markedly in their performance. Even if you limit yourself to just polyester (or polyamide/nylon, or whatever) you can vary between really very good and pretty ghastly. Just like synthetic base layers the proof of the pudding is in the trying.Bmblbzzz wrote: ↑2 Dec 2022, 12:29am I have a silk liner and a synthetic one. I'm not sure whether the synthetic one is nylon or polyester or what (except that it's orange, which in itself is not IMO a good colour for something to sleep in!). I'm not convinced that either adds a huge amount of insulation, but whereas the synthetic one tends to feel cold on first getting and then gets clammy and sweaty during the night – it doesn't breathe much – the silk one tends to feel warmer against the skin and breathes reasonably well. It's also lighter and packs smaller. So from that pov, I'd recommend a silk liner over a synthetic one. Never tried a wool liner mind...
It was a hut to hut trip so no need for tent or stove. However, emergency sleeping bags and rather more in the way of warm clothing than I'd take cycling, and a waxing kit and ski/pole repair stuff. While Roos has her shovel on the outside mine is inside, along with avalanche probe and bothy bag, again stuff that's not really relevant cycling!
Judging from using a bothy bag (think a big bag in tent fly fabric which you pull over a huddle of 2 or more people and it's kept in place by them sitting on the lip) it can make a lot of difference. I was doing some winter skills training with my old Uni mountaineering club on one occasion and I had full winter mountaineering gear for Cairngorm snow and my charges had typical hillwalking kit. Come lunch time I got them in a bothy bag and stayed out myself as there wasn't room for us all and I had much better kit. After a bit they were all toasty thanks to one sheet of very thin nylon and communal heat and I was shivering despite full winter salopettes and a down jacket.horizon wrote: ↑1 Dec 2022, 11:24pmHowever the common factor for both modes might be two persons: not only can you make do with one set of whatever between you but each of you provides a heat source for the other, even just friends would do this in a small tent. I wonder (a) whether I am right on this and (b) if right, to what extent this really helps.
PS You also produce two sets of condensation . . .
I'd agree that not all synthetics are alike and didn't mean to give that impression. I'd say the same for cotton too.pjclinch wrote: ↑2 Dec 2022, 9:11amMy usual Weapon of Choice is a JagBags silk one so clearly I'm on board with silk being a Good Thing, but I'd suggest sweeping all synthetic fabrics in to one pot is a bit, well, sweeping. There's a huge range of synthetic fabrics available and they differ markedly in their performance. Even if you limit yourself to just polyester (or polyamide/nylon, or whatever) you can vary between really very good and pretty ghastly. Just like synthetic base layers the proof of the pudding is in the trying.Bmblbzzz wrote: ↑2 Dec 2022, 12:29am I have a silk liner and a synthetic one. I'm not sure whether the synthetic one is nylon or polyester or what (except that it's orange, which in itself is not IMO a good colour for something to sleep in!). I'm not convinced that either adds a huge amount of insulation, but whereas the synthetic one tends to feel cold on first getting and then gets clammy and sweaty during the night – it doesn't breathe much – the silk one tends to feel warmer against the skin and breathes reasonably well. It's also lighter and packs smaller. So from that pov, I'd recommend a silk liner over a synthetic one. Never tried a wool liner mind...
Sounds like a very good way to get one!As well as my usual silk liner I have a thick silk one that a pal brought back from Kathmandu (he took a cotton ME liner in to a local tailors and said "one of these in your thick silk please" and it was duly run up) that is nice for colder nights
Pertex... A couple of decades ago I had a supposedly waterproof jacket made of pertex – it was just about showerproof but nice to wear. The fabric seems to have gone out of fashion now after having been all the rage way back in the '90s.and a Pertex (very fine weave nylon, often used for sleeping bag inners/outers) one that I take on trips where I expect to get particularly dirty (it's much simpler to wash safely, including in the middle of nowhere, than the silk ones). It's not as nice as the silk ones but it certainly doesn't rate as unpleasant or clammy/sweaty.
I don't have, but have seen and have seen recommended, merino wool ones and fleece/pile ones for various degrees of warmth boost. Again, assume thermal contribution like PJs made of the same stuff.
Pete.
Pertex was originally a fabric but became a brand with various different flavours. First dreamed up by Hamish Hamilton (the man who designed the classic Force 10 and Buffalo Mountain Shirt) and developed by Perseverance Mills (hence "Pertex") the brand is now owned by a Japanse group, https://pertex.com/ is the brand website.
Nurture your Shakedry, Gore are discontinuing it! (see https://www.cyclingnews.com/news/shaked ... d-by-gore/)boblo wrote: ↑2 Dec 2022, 11:01am Pertex pullovers are brill for lightweight/packable windproofs. Until Castelli produced their Gabba/Perfetto, I wore one very regularly in winter on the bikes and still always take one into the hills. On the bikes, I still take an additional layer in winter but it's Shakedry which is another kettle of fish altogether being almost as light as Pertex but properly waterproof and still breathable.
