Pavement Parking

Pebble
Posts: 1930
Joined: 7 Jun 2020, 11:59pm

Pavement Parking

Post by Pebble »

Have just been reading in the Edinburgh News that they are going to change the law to make parking on Pavements and Cycle Lanes illegal, I always thought it was but may be not in Scotland? They are also going to remove the 5 min rule that can allow drivers to escape (they can slap the ticket on immediately). All sounds very promising, it is a nonsense the situation now with cycle lanes used as parking. I suspect Edinburgh council will enforce it, they're like that.

What is the rule soulth of the border? I take it is illegal but no one enforces it.
Bmblbzzz
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Joined: 18 May 2012, 7:56pm
Location: From here to there.

Re: Pavement Parking

Post by Bmblbzzz »

I think the only blanket prohibition in England & Wales is in London.

Ed: On pavement parking.
Last edited by Bmblbzzz on 5 Dec 2022, 3:41pm, edited 1 time in total.
Nearholmer
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Joined: 26 Mar 2022, 7:13am

Re: Pavement Parking

Post by Nearholmer »

The rule is that people park cars, and unload vans, in cycle lanes!

It’s worse in some places than others of course, and there’s a section of cycle lane in Luton where the problem (not that anyone except the odd person a bike seems to consider it such) is so bad that the cycle lane markings have been almost completely eroded away by taxis, cars and vans causing damage to the tarmac as they park-up.

The Highway Code is pretty clear on it (Rule 240): you Must Not stop or park on ….. a tram or cycle lane during its period of operation.

The HC contains numerous other must nots and do nots about parking that are routinely honoured in the breach, and that creates danger and problems when driving as well as when cycling.
PT1029
Posts: 1742
Joined: 16 Apr 2012, 9:20pm

Re: Pavement Parking

Post by PT1029 »

Motor vehicle parking on a pavement in England is not illegal.
A few years ago (3?) there was a DfT consultation about banning parking on pavements. I submitted a comprehensive response for our local group. It seems to have gone into the Whitehall abyss, nothing has come of it (yet).
pwa
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Re: Pavement Parking

Post by pwa »

Pebble wrote: 5 Dec 2022, 3:11pm Have just been reading in the Edinburgh News that they are going to change the law to make parking on Pavements and Cycle Lanes illegal, I always thought it was but may be not in Scotland? They are also going to remove the 5 min rule that can allow drivers to escape (they can slap the ticket on immediately). All sounds very promising, it is a nonsense the situation now with cycle lanes used as parking. I suspect Edinburgh council will enforce it, they're like that.

What is the rule soulth of the border? I take it is illegal but no one enforces it.
I don't know about cycle lanes, but parking with wheels on pavements is not illegal in Wales. I think you may be open to a charge of obstructing a highway if you completely block a footway for a user group (e.g. wheelchair users), but other than that, it is not illegal. A man who used to live in our village parked his car collection partly on a footway and the police knocked on his door to have a word about it. He told them that as there was still lots of room for people to pass he wasn't breaking any rules so he wasn't going to move his cars. They went away and that was that.
Pebble
Posts: 1930
Joined: 7 Jun 2020, 11:59pm

Re: Pavement Parking

Post by Pebble »

pwa wrote: 6 Dec 2022, 7:15am
Pebble wrote: 5 Dec 2022, 3:11pm Have just been reading in the Edinburgh News that they are going to change the law to make parking on Pavements and Cycle Lanes illegal, I always thought it was but may be not in Scotland? They are also going to remove the 5 min rule that can allow drivers to escape (they can slap the ticket on immediately). All sounds very promising, it is a nonsense the situation now with cycle lanes used as parking. I suspect Edinburgh council will enforce it, they're like that.

What is the rule soulth of the border? I take it is illegal but no one enforces it.
I don't know about cycle lanes, but parking with wheels on pavements is not illegal in Wales. I think you may be open to a charge of obstructing a highway if you completely block a footway for a user group (e.g. wheelchair users), but other than that, it is not illegal. A man who used to live in our village parked his car collection partly on a footway and the police knocked on his door to have a word about it. He told them that as there was still lots of room for people to pass he wasn't breaking any rules so he wasn't going to move his cars. They went away and that was that.
I believe that is exactly the situation up here but as of late 2023 it will become illegal (either just in Edinburgh or hopefully all of scotland) and with Edinburgh council wishing to fund 3 new traffic warden jobs out of the estimated £100,000 a year it will raise. I think we will see change (edinburgh traffic wardens are renowned for their ruthlessness) . LOL. I would quite happily volunteer 1 day a week, I would specialise on the giant 4x4 SUVs that plauge edinburgh
It will be interesting to see what happens, some streets are so narrow that if people didn't park partially on the pavement then gridlock would result. Folk in their stupidly oversized cars and trucks, serves them right.
Last edited by Pebble on 6 Dec 2022, 8:15am, edited 1 time in total.
Nearholmer
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Re: Pavement Parking

Post by Nearholmer »

Back to cycle lanes for a minute:

Reading around, it appears that the law is more muddy than the “must not” in the Highway Code implies.

Here is a government announcement of better enforcement capabilities https://www.gov.uk/government/news/new- ... lists-safe

If you notice, the illustration shows double yellow lines at the kerb as well as mandatory (solid) white line to delineate the cycle lane. The guidance note that goes with the power to use CCTV for prosecutions seems to say that if there are no yellow lines (double or single) parking, but not driving, in a mandatory bike lane is permitted. It also contains a reminder that pulling over to the kerb for a short period to pick up or drop off a passenger is allowed anywhere, irrespective of what lines exist.
Pebble
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Joined: 7 Jun 2020, 11:59pm

Re: Pavement Parking

Post by Pebble »

From what I understand with the edinburgh proposal, parking on "Green-ways" will be outlawed. I guess Green-ways will be recognised cycle routes. and with the wardens not having to observe the parked car for 5 minutes, there will be no arsing about.
Steve X
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Joined: 14 Apr 2021, 7:47am

Re: Pavement Parking

Post by Steve X »

Nearholmer wrote: 5 Dec 2022, 3:28pm The rule is that people park cars, and unload vans, in cycle lanes!



The Highway Code is pretty clear on it (Rule 240): you Must Not stop or park on ….. a tram or cycle lane during its period of operation.

Near where I live there there is a cycle lane with broken lines, with no time limits. Cars always park on them. I just assumed that cars can. They have never ever been enforced as cycle lanes. I always have wondered what exactly was the point of painting them in the first place.
https://goo.gl/maps/GgECp6GeaDsLS3gG9

Do the rules include this cycle lane?
How is responsible for enforcing this?
Is it actually possible to get them to enforce this?
Nearholmer
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Joined: 26 Mar 2022, 7:13am

Re: Pavement Parking

Post by Nearholmer »

Broken line cycleways are advisory only, drivers are advised not to drive in them if a cyclist is using them, but not banned from doing so. All they really are is a reminder to watch out for cyclists in narrow roads.

If I’m right about parking in mandatory ones, then I guess it must be “OK” to park in advisory ones in the absence of yellow lines, although the advisory ones round here are on bits off road where parking would be a seriously daft idea (very narrow, quite twisty, hilly) and would probably be an offence under general rules.

Local authorities enforce parking rules unless the offence is one that obstructs the highway or creates gross danger, in which case the police get involved, but things seem to vary a bit by location. I’ve never seen a local authority bod outside of a town centre, and these days they are mostly contractors making sure you’ve paid, rather than traffic wardens preventing bad parking.

I used to be a parish councillor and when problems cropped up we’d ask either the local authority or the police to get involved according to the problem. If it was neighbours annoying/obstructing one another by inconsiderate parking in a built-up area (common!) we’d get the “big council” involved; if it was dangerous parking on corners outside the pub in the village (also common!) we’d ask the police to help.

Near here we have several villages with pubs on tight right-angle bends and people parking on the crowns of the bends, or ‘just round the corner’, is a constant PITA. It forces divers, cyclists and equestrians into the middle of narrow roads, continually causing near head-ons and the odd actual head-on.
Last edited by Nearholmer on 6 Dec 2022, 11:08am, edited 1 time in total.
mattheus
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Location: Western Europe

Re: Pavement Parking

Post by mattheus »

pwa wrote: 6 Dec 2022, 7:15am ... but parking with wheels on pavements is not illegal in Wales. I think you may be open to a charge of obstructing a highway if you completely block a footway for a user group (e.g. wheelchair users), but other than that, it is not illegal. A man who used to live in our village parked his car collection partly on a footway and the police knocked on his door to have a word about it. He told them that as there was still lots of room for people to pass he wasn't breaking any rules so he wasn't going to move his cars. They went away and that was that.
Same in England.
Crazy thing is that it's illegal to *drive* on a pavement, so in theory a policeman witnessing that could do something!
simonhill
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Joined: 13 Jan 2007, 11:28am
Location: Essex

Re: Pavement Parking

Post by simonhill »

Cross posted with above.

As I understand it parking on the pavement is not illegal, except in London. The Govt has given local authorities the right to get such powers but no others have (last I heard). Or something like this - I'm sure to be corrected.

An interesting point is that it is illegal to drive on the pavement (?footway), so if a car is parked there they MUST have driven on the pavement.

I hate it, but where I live road parking would be halved in some places if it was made illegal and no local council is going to do that. It has been discussed here before.

My problem is people driving on the pavement outside my house to avoid slowing or giving way. Modern cars easily mount the kerb, or a run in, drive along pavement and drop off when road is clear.
mattheus
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Joined: 29 Dec 2008, 12:57pm
Location: Western Europe

Re: Pavement Parking

Post by mattheus »

simonhill wrote: 6 Dec 2022, 9:04am My problem is people driving on the pavement outside my house to avoid slowing or giving way. Modern cars easily mount the kerb, or a run in, drive along pavement and drop off when road is clear.
Endemic problem, sadly.

I used to live opposite a drive-thru post-box!
Jdsk
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Re: Pavement Parking

Post by Jdsk »

PT1029 wrote: 6 Dec 2022, 7:06am ...
A few years ago (3?) there was a DfT consultation about banning parking on pavements. I submitted a comprehensive response for our local group. It seems to have gone into the Whitehall abyss, nothing has come of it (yet).
Yes. The consultation closed but I can't even find a summary of the submissions, let alone a response:

https://www.gov.uk/government/consultat ... nt-parking

Jonathan
Vorpal
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Re: Pavement Parking

Post by Vorpal »

The Highway Code is pretty clear https://www.gov.uk/guidance/the-highway ... 238-to-252

Unfortunately, Everyplace except London (and specific places where there is an order preventing it), pavement parking is a 'should not' rather than 'must not'
Rule 244
You MUST NOT park partially or wholly on the pavement in London, and should not do so elsewhere unless signs permit it. Parking on the pavement can obstruct and seriously inconvenience pedestrians, people in wheelchairs or with visual impairments and people with prams or pushchairs.
And outside of those lanes marked with hours of operation (usually shared bus & cycle lanes),
Rule 240
You MUST NOT stop or park on

<snip>
-a tram or cycle lane during its period of operation
-a cycle track
NB: the cycle track here, is the specific bit of separate infrastructure reserved for cyclists, as opposed to shared use

Not parking on cycle lanes is 'do not' instead of 'must not'
Rule 243
DO NOT stop or park:

<snip>
-where you would force other traffic to enter a tram lane
-where the kerb has been lowered to help wheelchair users and powered mobility vehicles
-in front of an entrance to a property
-on a bend
-where you would obstruct cyclists’ use of cycle facilities

except when forced to do so by stationary traffic.
Which means that it is associated with a regulation, but the regulation does not cover the specific circumstances. It just states that you cannot leave your vehicle in a way that causes an obstruction.

The existing law should be sufficient, but it is not generally interpreted in favour of cyclists and pedestrians. For that reason, clarification, like in London is good, and a general ban on pavement parking would be even better. Unfortunately, in most areas, parking enforcement is down to the local authorities who often do not have resources to enforce it.
“In some ways, it is easier to be a dissident, for then one is without responsibility.”
― Nelson Mandela, Long Walk to Freedom
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