Atriall Fibrillation

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cc1085
Posts: 95
Joined: 8 Feb 2015, 11:41pm

Atriall Fibrillation

Post by cc1085 »

Hi All,
Anyone on here have this heart condition and if so are they still cycling ? I have been diagnosed as such didn't have any previous symptoms of any kind.
Thanks
Thom
Jdsk
Posts: 24639
Joined: 5 Mar 2019, 5:42pm

Re: Atrial Fibrillation

Post by Jdsk »

Thread from 2020:
viewtopic.php?t=142359
including some personal experiences and the NHS advice.

And some previous discussions, but NB treatment and advice might have changed:
viewtopic.php?t=67395
viewtopic.php?t=25282
viewtopic.php?t=213

Have you discussed cycling and other exercise with your doctor?

Jonathan
Last edited by Jdsk on 21 Jan 2023, 5:59pm, edited 1 time in total.
cc1085
Posts: 95
Joined: 8 Feb 2015, 11:41pm

Re: Atriall Fibrillation

Post by cc1085 »

Jdsk wrote: 21 Jan 2023, 5:42pm Thread from 2020:
viewtopic.php?t=142359
including some personal experiences and the NHS advice.

Have you discussed this with your doctor?

Jonathan
Thanks Jonathan, yes I've been to hospital (last wed.) and had all the tests to confirm and been prescribed blood thinners. I have to attend at doctor's on this Monday. Just went for a medical to renew driving licence and it was detected then. (!"£$%^& aagh!)
Jdsk
Posts: 24639
Joined: 5 Mar 2019, 5:42pm

Re: Atrial Fibrillation

Post by Jdsk »

Thanks

Usual advice for that consultation on Monday:

• Write down any questions so that you don't forget them. (And those previous discussions might raise some.)

• Ask if you can stay in touch by email/ whatever so that you can discuss progress.

Jonathan
ChrisButch
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Joined: 24 Feb 2009, 12:10pm

Re: Atrial Fibrillation

Post by ChrisButch »

Jdsk wrote: 21 Jan 2023, 5:42pm Thread from 2020:
viewtopic.php?t=142359
including some personal experiences and the NHS advice.

And some previous discussions, but NB treatment and advice might have changed:
viewtopic.php?t=67395
viewtopic.php?t=25282
viewtopic.php?t=213

Have you discussed cycling and other exercise with your doctor?

Jonathan
The previous advice etc contained in those (lengthy) threads still holds true, as there have been no significant advances in therapies etc since that time (as it happens I was discussing this with my cardiologist only a couple of days ago).
However, the association between AF and the long-term practice of endurance sports such as cycling is becoming increasingly recognised in the literature. It still remains true, unfortunately, that the medical profession has a tendency to trivialise the condition and is reluctant to acknowledge the extent to which it can radically affect lifestyles. (Obviously that's a broad generalisation, and there are a lot of exceptions, but it's advisable to keep it in mind).
cc1085
Posts: 95
Joined: 8 Feb 2015, 11:41pm

Re: Atrial Fibrillation

Post by cc1085 »

Jdsk wrote: 21 Jan 2023, 6:01pm Thanks

Usual advice for that consultation on Monday:

• Write down any questions so that you don't forget them. (And those previous discussions might raise some.)

• Ask if you can stay in touch by email/ whatever so that you can discuss progress.

Jonathan
Thanks for advice. I'll let you know how it goes.
axel_knutt
Posts: 2881
Joined: 11 Jan 2007, 12:20pm

Re: Atriall Fibrillation

Post by axel_knutt »

I'm not one of the ones you'll be wanting to hear from, I've been going downhill ever since I developed AF in 2010. My last cycle touring was in 2011, and every attempt at regaining my fitness since then has made me worse, the last being 3 years ago which forced me to give up cycling altogether. A recent attempt at a little more gentle walking whilst wearing a holter monitor has left me so bad I'm on the verge of needing a mobility scooter just to get to Tesco. But my AF was caused by 30 years of overtraining, so it's probably not repesentative of most.

These may be of interest:
Hoogsteen: 9 Year follow-up study of athletes with AF
Heidbuchel: Recommendations for participation in physical activity
Zipes: Eligibility recommendations for competing in sport
“I'm not upset that you lied to me, I'm upset that from now on I can't believe you.”
― Friedrich Nietzsche
ebor62
Posts: 34
Joined: 27 Apr 2017, 7:39pm
Location: West Sussex

Re: Atriall Fibrillation

Post by ebor62 »

Having started cycle racing in the early 60's before heart rate monitors, the norm was to check your pulse to make sure you were rested and not overtraining. I had always continued this and was used to my resting heart rate been about 45 bpm rising to 52 as I got older. In 2019 I was cycling well and did over 13000 miles in the year, including a 600k audax in 36 hours. However in 2020 in the depths of the pandemic, I noticed that my pulse was uneven , going slow then fast. This lasted for about 3 days and then it went back to normal. I had checks at the doctors and hospitals and short and long ecg tests but nothing showed up. The irregular pulse again showed up and I returned to the doctors and referred to hospital heart consultants. Among many tests , an ultra sound scan of the heart showed valves etc ok but 2 of the chambers significantly oversized. I was diagnosed with permanent atrial Fibrillation and this is still the same 18 months later. I was informed that there was very little hope of any intervention been successful due to the oversize chambers, and they would control the situation with medication. The suggested cause was many years of endurance cycling I take Beta Blockers and Blood Thinners. I tried to continue cycling but found it impossible. I have not given up hope but have lost so much strength and movement I know it is going to be a struggle. The NHS has been under so much strain for the last 2 years it has been difficult to progress, It has made me realize how much joy cycling has given me in the past and I need to give it another try.
Tim Holman
Posts: 132
Joined: 1 Aug 2020, 9:51am

Re: Atriall Fibrillation

Post by Tim Holman »

Hello, all. Hello, Thom, I have AF and have had it for nearly thirty years following a viral infection of my heart muscle in 1995. Cardiomyopathy it was called at the time. I was physically fit when I became ill. I had always been a hillwalker and a cyclist and a smallholder. Long story but I have been both lucky and determined and incredibly well looked after by my wife, my friends and the NHS over many years. I am a cyclist still and cycling is very much part of my everyday health in terms of fitness, overall therapy and mental health.
Ha ha cue for jokes about overalls, I do wear lycra. My cycling is slow but steady and I do it for both pleasure and purpose. Ha more jokes.
I get out on the bike, a Dawes Galaxy, almost daily usually hoping for 20km or more depending on lots of variables. So far as treatment goes I have mostly been maintained on a selection box of medication. However I have also received cardioversion a number of times.
AF is real; it is worrying; there is a way forward. Good luck and best wishes,
Tim
softlips
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Joined: 12 Dec 2016, 8:51pm

Re: Atriall Fibrillation

Post by softlips »

AF is no longer considered the benign condition it once was. Over the last 3-5 years the guidelines have suggested more aggressive treatment protocols. I'd look at NICE recommendations and ESC recommendations . The days of simply prescribing warfarin for everyone in AF should be over.
ChrisButch
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Joined: 24 Feb 2009, 12:10pm

Re: Atriall Fibrillation

Post by ChrisButch »

softlips wrote: 22 Jan 2023, 5:13pm AF is no longer considered the benign condition it once was. Over the last 3-5 years the guidelines have suggested more aggressive treatment protocols. I'd look at NICE recommendations and ESC recommendations . The days of simply prescribing warfarin for everyone in AF should be over.
Yes. If you're suitable (not everybody is) ablation can produce miraculous results. In 2001 I was one of the early UK patients to receive it, after increasing frequency of paroxysmal AF episodes. It was spectacularly successful, kept me free of AF for 16 years, was able to return to full cycling fitness. It only returned after a series of unrelated events (including a damaged pacemaker). Two further ablations were failures, and I'm now in permanent AF and cycling is more or less finished. But I'll always be grateful for those rescued 16 years. The success rate for ablation is now high.
axel_knutt
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Joined: 11 Jan 2007, 12:20pm

Re: Atriall Fibrillation

Post by axel_knutt »

Tim Holman wrote: 21 Jan 2023, 9:34pmMy cycling is slow but steady and I do it for both pleasure and purpose.
What do you call slow? I never was fast, even pre-AF. My fastest ride in my 20s was about 17mph over 9m, in my 40s I was typically doing 11-12, and about 8.5 on tour. I had a 39m regular training circuit, and my ambition was to do it in 3h, but I never managed it. Best was 3:10ish IIRC.
softlips wrote: 22 Jan 2023, 5:13pmAF is no longer considered the benign condition it once was.
Try telling that to my cardio dept, they won't accept that AF is any reason not to exercise or that exercise has anything to do with my AF.
ChrisButch wrote: 22 Jan 2023, 6:23pmYes. If you're suitable (not everybody is) ablation can produce miraculous results. In 2001 I was one of the early UK patients to receive it, after increasing frequency of paroxysmal AF episodes. It was spectacularly successful, kept me free of AF for 16 years, was able to return to full cycling fitness. It only returned after a series of unrelated events (including a damaged pacemaker). Two further ablations were failures, and I'm now in permanent AF and cycling is more or less finished. But I'll always be grateful for those rescued 16 years. The success rate for ablation is now high.
I was put on Flecainide for my AF, which has a habit of causing atrial flutter in some patients, and I was the some patients. After being in and out of hospital for weeks, they decided to offer me a pulmonary vein isolation, at which point my AF & AFL decided to calm down a bit, so I went into a period of several months of dithering about what to do. Anyhow, by the time the following year's cycling season came along, so did my arrhythmia again, and I was in & out of hospital until I ended up in for a week and got put on Amiodarone. You may be familiar with it, it's classed as a drug of last resort because it has a reputation for killing patients, so it was the kick I needed to get me off the pot and opt for the ablation.

However, that was the point they decided they weren't going to do a PVI, which would have got me off the meds altogether if successful, and instead they did a cavo-tricuspid isthmus ablation to fix the flutter caused by the meds so that they could put me back onto Flecainide for the AF. I've asked them why they withdrew their offer of a PVI, but they just ignored the question.
Last edited by axel_knutt on 23 Jan 2023, 2:45pm, edited 2 times in total.
“I'm not upset that you lied to me, I'm upset that from now on I can't believe you.”
― Friedrich Nietzsche
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Audax67
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Re: Atriall Fibrillation

Post by Audax67 »

ebor62 wrote: 21 Jan 2023, 8:54pm The suggested cause was many years of endurance cycling I take Beta Blockers and Blood Thinners. I tried to continue cycling but found it impossible.
If they slapped you with a one-size-fits-all dose of BBs the effects could be devastating as far as cycling goes. When I was first on them 15 years ago, on the strength of one dodgy BP measurement, my cardiologist mentioned that a "homeopathic" dose did seem to have a radical effect on athletes. You may be able to get your dose reduced on the strength of that. After a couple of years of bellyaching my chappie actually did some more-painstaking examinations and dropped them entirely.

4 or 5 years back I had a single 6-beat salvo of Afib in 24 hours and he prescribed them again. I was mightily p'd off, but I discovered that a couple of coffees every 50 km counteracted them nicely. My doc told me that this was naughty but he didn't say not to do it. A while later we discontinued them yet again and I'm still here.

Anyway, if you can't get the dose reduced and you don't fancy the coffee gambit, which might admittedly be dangerous, I'd suggest slapping a motor on your bike. It would help keep your heart frequency down below the limit at which lactic acid forms and make it possible to have fun without your quads burning. My average heart rate has dropped about 15 beats since I fitted mine. I do feel a bit phoney when I ride up a col on 115 bpm, though.
Have we got time for another cuppa?
Tim Holman
Posts: 132
Joined: 1 Aug 2020, 9:51am

Re: Atriall Fibrillation

Post by Tim Holman »

Hello.. Axel, slow means about 15kph. I don't keep tabs on speed or distance generally because I find it's easier to do what I do, so to speak. My routes are mostly well known to me so it's easy to vary my strength of application rather than to go for speed or distance. Although there's always the temptation to do more especially if the weather is kind. I would not describe my kind of cycling as Endurance although yesterday's drizzle and gloom did make it something to be endured.
I have refused amiodarone because of the side effects, which were intolerable. I do take BBs which were recently varied but seem ok; echocardiogram is a wonderful view from inside your body of your heart performing live on stage, I have tried to buy a front row season ticket. My anticoagulants recently changed from warfarin with no ill effects so far. Cardiologists vary too: in my time I have had a few.
Tim
axel_knutt
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Joined: 11 Jan 2007, 12:20pm

Re: Atriall Fibrillation

Post by axel_knutt »

ebor62 wrote: 21 Jan 2023, 8:54pmThe suggested cause was many years of endurance cycling I take Beta Blockers and Blood Thinners. I tried to continue cycling but found it impossible.
The alternative to beta blockers is Diltiazem, it doesn't knacker your ability to exercise like BBs do, but the down side you need to watch for is oedema. It wasn't much of a problem for me when I first went on it, but slowly became a problem over time. Even when the swollen feet were quite bad, I was a bit too relaxed about it, and last summer I stopped taking it because the skin was coming off my feet.
Tim Holman wrote: 23 Jan 2023, 10:02amI have refused amiodarone because of the side effects, which were intolerable.
I had no problems with Amiodarone at all, but I was only on it for about 6 months whilst I was waiting for an ablation. I was still glad to get off it though because of its reputation.
“I'm not upset that you lied to me, I'm upset that from now on I can't believe you.”
― Friedrich Nietzsche
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