Cycling UK Forum

I left home at 5:30am, about my 4th day of owning a bicycle. I've been very proud of myself so far, achieving my goals every day and getting used to riding. Great day yesterday cycling on the roads, just one wobble at a roundabout but otherwise fine. I went out early today before light as I needed to practice some things without anyone being around - Namely hand signals without wobbling and riding on a camber.

There's a seafront prom very near me with just a little bit of road before it starts. There's quite a long stretch with little to no kerb between the road and prom, so I looked carefully to make sure it didn't look like more than the smallest of bumps, and I steered left onto the prom. Well I don't understand what happened other than I just couldn't seem to turn! The bike wanted to put me back on the road, and then I reached a higher kerb and lost my balance. I'm not too sure how it happened, it seemed such a silly mistake. I shall walk back there soon to look - I'll know exactly where as I left some blood on the path!

I've hurt my ribs, leg, knee, elbow and hands. I'm fine though, it's all achy and grazed but me and the bike are pretty much ok. I wasn't going too fast, I fell sideways and the bike landed on me.

There is a slight camber in that path and the same path caught me out the other day. I'm somehow finding a camber in the road to be a real problem. I'm embarrassed to even admit that as I never used to have any problems cycling as a teen. It was suggested in another thread that my bike may not be setup correctly, but I've checked and it's been assembled correctly. It's not the bike, it's me. Something about a slight camber in the road or path causes me to find it very hard to steer straight. I don't understand it. Is this normal for a hybrid/MTB?

I'll have about a week not able to use my bike from tomorrow due to visitors staying with me, which is good timing as I need to heal anyway before riding again. What a pain though to fall off so soon, I feel a complete fool. How can I lose balance with barely anything even there?

I'm ranting at myself, feel free to ignore me and thanks for listening.

Sorry to hear that.

Any manhole covers or white lines that could have contributed?

CyclingBlob wrote: ↑3 Sep 2023, 8:44am Namely hand signals without wobbling and riding on a camber.

I suggest working on where you're looking. When worried about these manoeuvres many of us tend to lower our point of gaze. I had problems with this when doing tight turns on a Vespa. Head up and look where you want to go.

Jonathan

Possibly a little bit of target fixation or trying to maintain a very upright balanced position on the bike ?
But congratulations on your success so far.

CyclingBlob wrote: ↑3 Sep 2023, 8:44am little to no kerb between the road and prom, so I looked carefully to make sure it didn't look like more than the smallest of bumps, and I steered left onto the prom.

I suggest that that smallest of ridges was enough to cause the wheel to move along it like a railway line instead of over it. Answer is to cross the ridge at more of an angle, or possibly quicker. I do not see that camber is much of a problem to a two wheeler.

tatanab wrote: ↑3 Sep 2023, 9:16am

CyclingBlob wrote: ↑3 Sep 2023, 8:44am little to no kerb between the road and prom, so I looked carefully to make sure it didn't look like more than the smallest of bumps, and I steered left onto the prom.

I suggest that that smallest of ridges was enough to cause the wheel to move along it like a railway line instead of over it. Answer is to cross the ridge at more of an angle, or possibly quicker. I do not see that camber is much of a problem to a two wheeler.

Yes. I was also thinking of tramlining. With some tyres on some bikes it doesn't take much of an edge to cause this.

Jonathan

CyclingBlob wrote: ↑3 Sep 2023, 8:44am ...What a pain though to fall off so soon, I feel a complete fool. How can I lose balance with barely anything even there?

I'm ranting at myself, feel free to ignore me and thanks for listening.

Don't worry about it. When I restarted cycling I had a couple of falls - really daft ones that were 110% my fault and nothing to do with surfaces or hazards, etc. It happens. As you are doing, try and learn but don't be discouraged.

Ian

Yes, approaching a very slight ridge, especially one with curved edges, at a very acute angle is a very good way to “trip up” the front wheel.

I’ve done it on roots in the woods, and twice(!) on a particularly treacherous section of curved brick “edger” near one of our local canal paths, always when “getting a bit carried away” (going too quick for the conditions) when it’s been damp underfoot.

It’s much less of a risk with specifically off-road tyres, which are usually run softer.

Thanks all for your comments and help. Sorry not to reply to everything separately - My wrist has got worse and it's quite hard to type now along with the grazes on the palm of the same hand.

The tramlines things - Good way to describe it, because it did feel like that, as if the tyre was caught. There was no ridge as such, just the camber of the edge of the path. I noticed it a couple of times now on very minor cambers, where the front tyre seems to not want to turn out of it. It actually steers me towards the lowest part and it's strangely hard to stop that.

One comment said it can happen when at a shallow angle so I should turn more into it. I was veering off the road onto the path at a very shallow angle. It's that issue that I was partly out to practice, yet immediately it caused the fall! When riding straight along the other day though, when going around people I had to get closer to the edge, and the slight camber there also made it feel like the tyre was dragging me closer to the edge. Quite disconcerting. It's almost as if it's slipping to the lowest point. Pressures are fine by the way.

No manhole covers, it was only caused by the camber. The same feeling as the last 2 days but I saved it the other times (different places).

Good advice to look where I'm going instead of down too much. I certainly was looking downwards a lot, concentrating on where to get off the road. I'll practice with that when I get out again.

I appreciate all the help and advice here.

Lots of good advice for you already.
Slight changes in surface, even between paving stones can catch anyone out. I nearly lost the front wheel in the wet when turning and cut the raised edge of a paving slab. Experience meant I didn't fall. That experience will come for you too

But buy some track mitts. They'll save your palms if you come off in future. Cut palms are no fun.

gazza_d wrote: ↑3 Sep 2023, 1:47pm Lots of good advice for you already.
Slight changes in surface, even between paving stones can catch anyone out. I nearly lost the front wheel in the wet when turning and cut the raised edge of a paving slab. Experience meant I didn't fall. That experience will come for you too

But buy some track mitts. They'll save your palms if you come off in future. Cut palms are no fun.

I'm amazed I wasn't able to save the fall, I really should have been able to. Like you say, it'll come with experience.

After a few rides I'd already decided to buy gloves/mitts of some sort, as my palms were getting quite sore even without falling off! So they're definitely on my shopping list.

CyclingBlob wrote: ↑3 Sep 2023, 1:53pm

gazza_d wrote: ↑3 Sep 2023, 1:47pm Lots of good advice for you already.
Slight changes in surface, even between paving stones can catch anyone out. I nearly lost the front wheel in the wet when turning and cut the raised edge of a paving slab. Experience meant I didn't fall. That experience will come for you too

But buy some track mitts. They'll save your palms if you come off in future. Cut palms are no fun.

I'm amazed I wasn't able to save the fall, I really should have been able to. Like you say, it'll come with experience.

After a few rides I'd already decided to buy gloves/mitts of some sort, as my palms were getting quite sore even without falling off! :) So they're definitely on my shopping list.

After a few months cycling I put my toe clips back on the bike (it came with them when new but I took them off until I was used to riding again). Then, at end good ride, I pulled up at closed gate to my house and ... for some reason I didn't even try to put a foot on the ground (not stuck in clips or anything), I just stopped and fell over! Entirely my stupidity and completely avoidable. Daft things happen sometimes.

Ian

1. WEAR GLOVES I prefer fingerless
2. Wear knee protection

Remember it may only be a 3' fall from a bike but can be a "pain"

Happens to us all

A month after the fall

1. WEAR GLOVES I prefer fingerless
2. Wear knee protection

Remember it may only be a 3' fall from a bike but can be a "pain"

Happens to us all, no pain more embarrassment

A month after the fall

Usually road features like railway crossings and cattle grids, which are a specific hazard to people on a bike, are oriented so that they are at 90 degrees to the cyclist's direction of travel. The first video below shows what can happen when that is not the case. If you find yourself approaching a railway crossing with the tracks, or a catttle grid, at a significantly smaller angle than 90 degrees, you need to correct your line before the rails/grid, or stop.

A dropped kerb is much less of a hazard, but if you attempt to ride up one at an extremely acute angle, there will be a risk. The risk is far greater with very narrow tyres. I once rode downhill on a road which had a patched road repair. The difference in height between the road and the patch edge was minimal, but on 23mm tyres the edge of the patch acted like a tramline and I felt I could no longer steer the bike. You have very wide tyres, so the effect would be less, but that might be offset somewhat if you have very high (front) tyre pressure giving a small tyre/road contact patch. It might be worth getting a tyre pressure gauge, e.g. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/265736770971 to help you ensure that you get the correct pressure for your tyres and weight.

I often have to ride up a dropped kerb in a similar situation on 50mm tyres. I will sometimes try to increase the angle by riding a bit further out into the road, and I use a mirror or shoulder check to make sure I have road space to drift out anything up to metre into the road, before initiating the turn towards the dropped kerb. However, at slow speeds I do not need to do that.

From your comments I wonder if you have forgotten how instinctively to steer a bike, or maybe rather you are concentrating too much on turning the handlebars to physically steer the bike. In other words, you may not be letting yourself do what you did instinctively as a teen when cycling, because you are now thinking too much about the process of turning the bars and steering, and your extra bodyweight may be a factor in that because it probably makes riding a bike feel so different from when you were a teen and steering the bike was just instinctive.

To be more specific, I wonder if you are trying to steer solely by turning the handlebars while staying upright, and not counter steering and lean steering sufficiently. I think that normally most of us do not even think about counter steering and lean steering or fully appreciate that is what we do, because it is so instinctive. I suspect the long period since you used to ride, your anxiety, and maybe the unfamiliar experience of having to get used to cycling with such a heavier bodyweight may be masking your old instinctive ability to ride a bike.

When you turn on a bike, you do so initially by counter steering. You may not even realise you are doing it, especially since the amount of counter steer is quite small. The counter steer will result in the front of the bike lowering slightly (stand next to your bike and move the bars from left to right and you will see this - it happens because the head tube and forks are not at 90 degrees to the ground). Your centre of gravity will no longer be over a line drawn between the front and rear tyre contact patches. You will in fact be leaning slightly. If you counter steered right, you will be leaning slightly to the left and you will instinctively turn the bars back to the left to correct the lean. That is what makes you turn and then come back upright. The second video below shows this on a motorbike.

On a camber, you will need to lean steer very slightly up the camber, to stop the bike going down the camber. Many cyclists find riding a tricycle difficult to begin with, because trikes are not lean steered. On a typical UK road with a slight camber from the centre to the edge of the road, a trike has to be constantly steered away from the edge of the road.

Psamathe wrote: ↑3 Sep 2023, 3:34pm After a few months cycling I put my toe clips back on the bike (it came with them when new but I took them off until I was used to riding again). Then, at end good ride, I pulled up at closed gate to my house and ... for some reason I didn't even try to put a foot on the ground (not stuck in clips or anything), I just stopped and fell over! Entirely my stupidity and completely avoidable. Daft things happen sometimes.

Ian

I hadn't even considered clips to be honest. My bike didn't come with any, but the idea of them actually scares me at the moment as my feet are bound to get stuck! With my current level of riding it's probably not a good thing to have.

It's good to hear I'm not the only one who has these things happen. I just wish I could have waited a few months so it didn't dent my enthusiasm! Actually I am looking forward to riding again ASAP. I can't now, mostly because my wrist is quite bad, but I can't wait to get back to it.

Geoff.