Is Argos' E-Move Electric bikes worth it?

[Paulatic]

This might be of interest within this thread GCN bought the cheapest E Bike from Amazon. https://youtu.be/zwPC28u4gII?si=PlnOErqPPZaDRyPf

[Bonzo Banana]

I would go with a Carrera Subway with mechanical disc brakes either new or secondhand. It's a strong 27.5" mountain bike but with rigid steel forks. Make use of every discount you can to reduce the price if new.

https://www.halfords.com/bikes/hybrid-b ... 46126.html

Maybe a kit like this;

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/334887136312?

Plus you will need a battery, maybe something like this;

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/333907764090?

Ultimately you want a mountain bike with rigid steel forks. These will cope with your weight. You are basically using the extra strength of a mountain bike to cope with your weight on the road. You want a front hub motor as steel is the best material to mount a hub motor too. I would also go for mechanical disc brakes as fine for the road and they work best with kits in fact most kits are set up for mechanical disc brakes or V brakes out of the box so no additional purchases necessary.

Bear in mind the battery I have linked to is 36V 15Ah which is 36x15= 540Wh which is decent capacity perhaps 3x as much as the lowest capacity battery packs included with prebuilt ebikes. It should give you a very decent range.

Of course you do have to fit the ebike kit so you need to be mechanically minded or at least know someone who can help you.

I wouldn't really see the subway as a mountain bike it doesn't have the same geometry as my cube acid -- more of a city bike with bigger tyres, but it is fairly strong.
Second hand there's not much difference in prices of mechanical or hydraulic disc brakes so I'd hold out for the hydraulic as mechanical can give a lot of trouble when the cables get gritty or tight.

One big advantage hydraulic have on top of less trouble and better braking is that when your loading your bike up with luggage, shopping or whatever and the brake hoses get pushed around by the stuff it won't affect braking at all. Whereas distorted wire cables can lead to pads rubbing on the discs.

As for kits - I fitted the YosePower kit to my subway -- comes with battery and tools ( even a set of Allen keys ) to fit it. You might need a couple of spanners of your own. I fitted mine in one hour. I bought the extra brake sensors which took me another hour to fit. You'll need them anyway on the mechanical disc brake bike cos I think the brake levers are incorporated into the gear shifters on that mechanical disc bike so you can't use the brake levers supplied in kit. My workmate had this problem with his 1990's bike and opted to buy separate shimano gear triggers so he could use the yose brake levers. A bit more work but turned out a good rim brake ebike.

My like new second hand subway 2 hydraulic disc bike cost £200 the kit cost £400. So I've a practically new ebike for £600 that does 60 miles on lowest power setting and there's no anxiety about parts availability etc.

Oh and fit a rear hub -- the front hub snatches and pulls at the crown bearings as the power kicks in whereas with the weight on the more rigidly mounted rear hub it's dead smooth and you'll not need a torque arm.

Traditionally the Subway has had the same geometry as many of the Carrera hardtail mountain bikes. It is the Carrera Crossfire which is the the more traditional hybrid model in the range. The Subway is a much stronger design. The Cube acid may have more fashionable up to date geometry but typically Cube bikes have much lower weight limits and a shorter warranty than Halfords bikes and are often less overbuilt. I seem to remember a lot of Cube bikes were coming from Bangladesh factories who are not highly rated for quality hence the lower weight limits and shorter frame warranties. I'd be very surprised if a typical Carrera hardtail model wasn't significantly stronger than a similar Cube model. I suspect if we had access to the frame certification the Cube frame would not have been tested to the same level. Halfords typically sell stronger slightly heavier bikes.

https://www.thedailystar.net/business/n ... es-1632277

[Cowsham]

I would go with a Carrera Subway with mechanical disc brakes either new or secondhand. It's a strong 27.5" mountain bike but with rigid steel forks. Make use of every discount you can to reduce the price if new.

https://www.halfords.com/bikes/hybrid-b ... 46126.html

Maybe a kit like this;

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/334887136312?

Plus you will need a battery, maybe something like this;

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/333907764090?

Ultimately you want a mountain bike with rigid steel forks. These will cope with your weight. You are basically using the extra strength of a mountain bike to cope with your weight on the road. You want a front hub motor as steel is the best material to mount a hub motor too. I would also go for mechanical disc brakes as fine for the road and they work best with kits in fact most kits are set up for mechanical disc brakes or V brakes out of the box so no additional purchases necessary.

Bear in mind the battery I have linked to is 36V 15Ah which is 36x15= 540Wh which is decent capacity perhaps 3x as much as the lowest capacity battery packs included with prebuilt ebikes. It should give you a very decent range.

Of course you do have to fit the ebike kit so you need to be mechanically minded or at least know someone who can help you.

I wouldn't really see the subway as a mountain bike it doesn't have the same geometry as my cube acid -- more of a city bike with bigger tyres, but it is fairly strong.
Second hand there's not much difference in prices of mechanical or hydraulic disc brakes so I'd hold out for the hydraulic as mechanical can give a lot of trouble when the cables get gritty or tight.

One big advantage hydraulic have on top of less trouble and better braking is that when your loading your bike up with luggage, shopping or whatever and the brake hoses get pushed around by the stuff it won't affect braking at all. Whereas distorted wire cables can lead to pads rubbing on the discs.

As for kits - I fitted the YosePower kit to my subway -- comes with battery and tools ( even a set of Allen keys ) to fit it. You might need a couple of spanners of your own. I fitted mine in one hour. I bought the extra brake sensors which took me another hour to fit. You'll need them anyway on the mechanical disc brake bike cos I think the brake levers are incorporated into the gear shifters on that mechanical disc bike so you can't use the brake levers supplied in kit. My workmate had this problem with his 1990's bike and opted to buy separate shimano gear triggers so he could use the yose brake levers. A bit more work but turned out a good rim brake ebike.

My like new second hand subway 2 hydraulic disc bike cost £200 the kit cost £400. So I've a practically new ebike for £600 that does 60 miles on lowest power setting and there's no anxiety about parts availability etc.

Oh and fit a rear hub -- the front hub snatches and pulls at the crown bearings as the power kicks in whereas with the weight on the more rigidly mounted rear hub it's dead smooth and you'll not need a torque arm.

Traditionally the Subway has had the same geometry as many of the Carrera hardtail mountain bikes. It is the Carrera Crossfire which is the the more traditional hybrid model in the range. The Subway is a much stronger design. The Cube acid may have more fashionable up to date geometry but typically Cube bikes have much lower weight limits and a shorter warranty than Halfords bikes and are often less overbuilt. I seem to remember a lot of Cube bikes were coming from Bangladesh factories who are not highly rated for quality hence the lower weight limits and shorter frame warranties. I'd be very surprised if a typical Carrera hardtail model wasn't significantly stronger than a similar Cube model. I suspect if we had access to the frame certification the Cube frame would not have been tested to the same level. Halfords typically sell stronger slightly heavier bikes.

https://www.thedailystar.net/business/n ... es-1632277

Well that's my favorite bike in my stable trashed. I've had two bad crashes off it right enough.

[Pinhead]

I wouldn't have any bike with front or rear drives now, two weeks ago one of our riders had a puncture, in the wet, god help anyone disconnecting cables, needing spanners and getting the wheel off let alone back in the wet with hub drives, no thanks.

[Pinhead]

Yes to the Carrera Subway "cheap" lowish quality bike but then add the Bafang £800 mid drive

[peterb]

I wouldn't have any bike with front or rear drives now, two weeks ago one of our riders had a puncture, in the wet, god help anyone disconnecting cables, needing spanners and getting the wheel off let alone back in the wet with hub drives, no thanks.

Not too much of a problem with Mahle X20 or X35 hub drives as the weight is quite manageable and all you need with my X35 bikes (Orbea and Ribble) is the appropriate large allen key to remove the wheel nuts. Dry run at home recommended to check cable disconnection etc. Anyway I tend to change the tyres on a bike if those supplied are not to my liking which gives me a good opportunity to familiarise myself with the process. The front wheel on my bikes is like any other, QR on one and through axle on the other.

[Cowsham]

I wouldn't have any bike with front or rear drives now, two weeks ago one of our riders had a puncture, in the wet, god help anyone disconnecting cables, needing spanners and getting the wheel off let alone back in the wet with hub drives, no thanks.

I've had punctures with my rear hub kit and up to now I've not had to take the wheel out.
..First I spin the wheel while looking at the tyre and nearly always find where the puncture is -- usually a thorn where I come from. Then I'll pop the tyre off near it and pull the tube out and patch it pop it back, pump it up and jobs a good un.

I do carry a 16mm spanner to remove the back wheel and a spare tube if needed ( think it's 16 can't remember it's so long since I put it in my kit -- haven't ever used it ) disconnecting the hub is one connector half way up the seat stay -- dead easy.

Once upon a time all bicycle wheels were secured with nuts.

Must have about 3 or 4 patches on that tube.

[Cowsham]

I wouldn't really see the subway as a mountain bike it doesn't have the same geometry as my cube acid -- more of a city bike with bigger tyres, but it is fairly strong.
Second hand there's not much difference in prices of mechanical or hydraulic disc brakes so I'd hold out for the hydraulic as mechanical can give a lot of trouble when the cables get gritty or tight.

One big advantage hydraulic have on top of less trouble and better braking is that when your loading your bike up with luggage, shopping or whatever and the brake hoses get pushed around by the stuff it won't affect braking at all. Whereas distorted wire cables can lead to pads rubbing on the discs.

As for kits - I fitted the YosePower kit to my subway -- comes with battery and tools ( even a set of Allen keys ) to fit it. You might need a couple of spanners of your own. I fitted mine in one hour. I bought the extra brake sensors which took me another hour to fit. You'll need them anyway on the mechanical disc brake bike cos I think the brake levers are incorporated into the gear shifters on that mechanical disc bike so you can't use the brake levers supplied in kit. My workmate had this problem with his 1990's bike and opted to buy separate shimano gear triggers so he could use the yose brake levers. A bit more work but turned out a good rim brake ebike.

My like new second hand subway 2 hydraulic disc bike cost £200 the kit cost £400. So I've a practically new ebike for £600 that does 60 miles on lowest power setting and there's no anxiety about parts availability etc.

Oh and fit a rear hub -- the front hub snatches and pulls at the crown bearings as the power kicks in whereas with the weight on the more rigidly mounted rear hub it's dead smooth and you'll not need a torque arm.

Traditionally the Subway has had the same geometry as many of the Carrera hardtail mountain bikes. It is the Carrera Crossfire which is the the more traditional hybrid model in the range. The Subway is a much stronger design. The Cube acid may have more fashionable up to date geometry but typically Cube bikes have much lower weight limits and a shorter warranty than Halfords bikes and are often less overbuilt. I seem to remember a lot of Cube bikes were coming from Bangladesh factories who are not highly rated for quality hence the lower weight limits and shorter frame warranties. I'd be very surprised if a typical Carrera hardtail model wasn't significantly stronger than a similar Cube model. I suspect if we had access to the frame certification the Cube frame would not have been tested to the same level. Halfords typically sell stronger slightly heavier bikes.

https://www.thedailystar.net/business/n ... es-1632277

Well that's my favorite bike in my stable trashed. I've had two bad crashes off it right enough.

No wait a minuit -- my bikes 2017 -- that articles 2018 so mines not made in Bangladesh --- yea !

Always wondered why they went to the single chain ring and that sram malarkey after 2018.

[Pinhead]

I wouldn't have any bike with front or rear drives now, two weeks ago one of our riders had a puncture, in the wet, god help anyone disconnecting cables, needing spanners and getting the wheel off let alone back in the wet with hub drives, no thanks.

Not too much of a problem with Mahle X20 or X35 hub drives as the weight is quite manageable and all you need with my X35 bikes (Orbea and Ribble) is the appropriate large allen key to remove the wheel nuts. Dry run at home recommended to check cable disconnection etc. Anyway I tend to change the tyres on a bike if those supplied are not to my liking which gives me a good opportunity to familiarise myself with the process. The front wheel on my bikes is like any other, QR on one and through axle on the other.

That is the problem or one, people have no idea what to do, I doubt many these days have changed a car tyre either when the day comes they find the spare is flat

[Pinhead]

I wouldn't have any bike with front or rear drives now, two weeks ago one of our riders had a puncture, in the wet, god help anyone disconnecting cables, needing spanners and getting the wheel off let alone back in the wet with hub drives, no thanks.

I've had punctures with my rear hub kit and up to now I've not had to take the wheel out.
..First I spin the wheel while looking at the tyre and nearly always find where the puncture is -- usually a thorn where I come from. Then I'll pop the tyre off near it and pull the tube out and patch it pop it back, pump it up and jobs a good un.

I do carry a 16mm spanner to remove the back wheel and a spare tube if needed ( think it's 16 can't remember it's so long since I put it in my kit -- haven't ever used it ) disconnecting the hub is one connector half way up the seat stay -- dead easy.

Once upon a time all bicycle wheels were secured with nuts.

Must have about 3 or 4 patches on that tube.

Can you "replace" the tube not taking the wheel off no, not all punctures can be repaired

[Bonzo Banana]

Yes to the Carrera Subway "cheap" lowish quality bike but then add the Bafang £800 mid drive

IMG_1626.JPG

Is it a lowish quality bike? I think the current Subway is made by Insera Sena the big Indonesian bike manufacturer who own the Polygon and Marin brands. They also make or have made for Scott, Kona, Calibre, Saracen and many other bike brands. The Subway has better components than many more expensive competitors. At the end of the day most European and US brands are just importers they don't make anything themselves. Yes Halfords don't spend huge money on advertising or sponsorship of sporting events but I'd personally not want to pay for that I'd rather have the best bike for the money I'm spending. Some of the Carrera, Voodoo and Boardman bikes are brilliant value for money especially as there is usually vouchers to use and other ways to discount the price. Also Halfords haven't had the huge amount of frame recalls that brands like Decathlon have had for example they have pretty much had none. I am not connected to Halfords in anyway but a few years ago 25p in every £ spent on cycling was spent in Halfords in the UK which could equate to as much as 40% of bike sales due to their pricing.

I just think they are a brilliant place to buy a bike and often many of their competitors bikes are much inferior for similar money.

I personally think the Subway is a very good quality bike. It's hard to think of a safer bike, it's simple and strong with decent freehub based gearing. A very low maintenance bike that will take a lot of abuse.

[Bonzo Banana]

I wouldn't have any bike with front or rear drives now, two weeks ago one of our riders had a puncture, in the wet, god help anyone disconnecting cables, needing spanners and getting the wheel off let alone back in the wet with hub drives, no thanks.

Not sure why you have included front hub motors in that point as they can be pretty easy to deal with as you haven't got the gearing involved. It can be simply disconnecting one inline electrical plug and socket by pulling apart and then undoing the nuts. Probably adds no more than a minute over a quick release wheel plus you have the benefit its more difficult to steal. If you have a bike with a front hub motor and rear hub gears the rear hub gears are definitely much more of a pain to change tubes etc. Those are much more involved. Also if you are a heavier rider like myself you are much more likely to get punctures on the rear where more of your weight is so a front hub motor is far less likely to get punctures anyway.

Also mid-dive motors have their own set of problems, they are much more likely to snap chains especially e-mountain bikes with torque approaching 100Nm plus the drivetrain wears at a much faster rate causing a greater frequency of drivetrain component failures.

Sealant or use of downhill inner tubes can make punctures far less likely anyway and the use of any motor means you don't have to be so obsessed with bike weight so you can fit thicker heavier tyres that are more resistant to punctures.

Lets also not forget the superior reliability of hub motors too over mid-drive. They are much simpler designs and more over-built. A mid-drive is a small high rpm motor often connected by nylon cogs and a belt all in a tiny space with the controller circuit board. Often proprietary and expensive and slow to repair as not typically repairable by a home mechanic. Often the bicycle frame itself is purposely designed for that mid-drive motor so everything is linked. Hub motor ebikes are much easier to service and repair and at worst you may have to swap out a component.

I personally think hub motors are far, far superior for general road riding. It's only really off-road where e-mountain bikes benefit from mid-drive for performance reasons only.and their higher torque typically.

[UpWrong]

Can you "replace" the tube not taking the wheel off no, not all punctures can be repaired

You can with double ended Gaadi inner tube.

[Cowsham]

I wouldn't have any bike with front or rear drives now, two weeks ago one of our riders had a puncture, in the wet, god help anyone disconnecting cables, needing spanners and getting the wheel off let alone back in the wet with hub drives, no thanks.

I've had punctures with my rear hub kit and up to now I've not had to take the wheel out.
..First I spin the wheel while looking at the tyre and nearly always find where the puncture is -- usually a thorn where I come from. Then I'll pop the tyre off near it and pull the tube out and patch it pop it back, pump it up and jobs a good un.

I do carry a 16mm spanner to remove the back wheel and a spare tube if needed ( think it's 16 can't remember it's so long since I put it in my kit -- haven't ever used it ) disconnecting the hub is one connector half way up the seat stay -- dead easy.

Once upon a time all bicycle wheels were secured with nuts.

Must have about 3 or 4 patches on that tube.

Can you "replace" the tube not taking the wheel off no, not all punctures can be repaired

Hence the spanner and spare tube I mentioned ???

[Pinhead]

I've had punctures with my rear hub kit and up to now I've not had to take the wheel out.
..First I spin the wheel while looking at the tyre and nearly always find where the puncture is -- usually a thorn where I come from. Then I'll pop the tyre off near it and pull the tube out and patch it pop it back, pump it up and jobs a good un.

I do carry a 16mm spanner to remove the back wheel and a spare tube if needed ( think it's 16 can't remember it's so long since I put it in my kit -- haven't ever used it ) disconnecting the hub is one connector half way up the seat stay -- dead easy.

Once upon a time all bicycle wheels were secured with nuts.

Must have about 3 or 4 patches on that tube.

Can you "replace" the tube not taking the wheel off no, not all punctures can be repaired

Hence the spanner and spare tube I mentioned ???

I don't disagree it is just a lot more faf than a mid motor, I have tried it