Does endurance sport harm your heart?

[Slowroad]

I listen to podcasts of radio programmes, and just caught this one from More Or Less in early December: https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/w3ct5b7d
Cycling was mentioned so I thought others might be interested.

[briansnail]

Everything in moderation.

[Ayseven]

Cycling is always hard on you. Very hard to do it "moderately"!

[briansnail]

Cycling is always hard on you. Very hard to do it "moderately"!

Agreed.What the experts say is build up.If you do no exercise.Walk 5 mins first week a day.10 mins second week.Slowly build this up to endurance Cycling or Running Swimming.

This is the answer go slowly.Increase steadily.So your body adapts
*****************.***********************************
I ride Brompton,Hetchins 531.

[Jdsk]

Cycling is always hard on you. Very hard to do it "moderately"!

I often go on rides that aren't hard. And a lot of utility cycling doesn't go beyond moderate exercise.

Does this connect to those interesting comparisons between cycling in the UK and elsewhere?

Jonathan

[Jon in Sweden]

I'll listen to that episode of More of Less tomorrow - it's always a great show.

As regards the question in the title of this thread, my understanding is no. Everything I have researched/read/listened to has suggested that a combination of a base of zone 2 training, combined with V02 max work leads to a long and healthy life.

VO2 max as a predictor of all cause mortality is very accurate. There is no upper limit at which point a higher V02 max will result in negative outcomes. Fundamentally, the higher you can get your VO2 max when you are younger, the longer you'll be able to maintain a good quality of life (with regular exercise).

My understanding is that in order to maintain what would be regarded by most as an acceptable quality of life in older age, a man needs a V02 max of at least 20 and a woman 16. Once you fall below that level, simple tasks such as climbing stairs become very difficult. And then you fall easily into the trap of avoiding doing these things because they're hard, but that they also become harder because you don't do them.

I'm 20 months and 21,000km back into cycling and I'm feeling really good. I cycle hard, but I'm fairly intelligent about my training (I competed as a kid) and make sure to have recovery sessions. But in addition to my cycling, I try to ensure that I achieve a balance of other sports. So just now, this is my typical week:

10hrs cycling
3hrs resistance training
3hrs skiing
1-3hrs other gentle sports such as hiking or table tennis.

The resistance training is really so important too. I do think that many serious cyclists are far too thin and neglect strength in favour of lightness. I think it's counterproductive to try to emulate a GC rider such as Vingegaard or Pogacar. A healthier role model would be Mattieu Van de Poel or Wout Van Aert.

To swing back to the original question, endurance training combined with V02 max work, resistance training and mobility training is the key to a long and healthy life.

And a good diet.

And lots of sauna mixed with ice dipping.

And low stress.

And no loneliness.

And this and that and everything else.

It's tricky!

[Grandad]

I'm an 88 year old nerd who has recorded every mile since riding to school age 12, Have covered 371,000 miles including 43 years commuting over 10-32 miles a day, 500+ time trials between ages 19 to 63 with a 24 hour at 59 and 151 audax rides up to 600k between
ages 56 and 83.

Developed atrial fibrillation when 65, 2 ablations were only temporary cures and for the last 19 years the advice has been "live with it"

Bought an e-bike 3 years ago and left the clubruns a year later. Became increasingly breathless 6 months ago and stopped riding. Diagnosed as fluid on the lungs "cured" by medication so am doing very short (12-15 mile) rides whilst waiting to see if a pacemaker is needed.

Have these miles caused the heart problems or are they the reason that I am still riding and otherwise in good health?

[Nearholmer]

I think what I might do in your shoes would be to find out how many men were born in the same year as you, and how many are (a) still alive, and (b) well enough to cycle even modest distances. My intuition is that this will illustrate that cycling can’t have done you much harm.

I can’t find exact numbers quickly, but from what I can find it looks as if you are among the longest living c3% of men born in 1936 ……. On that basis I reckon it’s done you good.

[Grandad]

Actually December 1935 but I don't suppose that will make much difference

[Jon in Sweden]

I'm an 88 year old nerd who has recorded every mile since riding to school age 12, Have covered 371,000 miles including 43 years commuting over 10-32 miles a day, 500+ time trials between ages 19 to 63 with a 24 hour at 59 and 151 audax rides up to 600k between
ages 56 and 83.

Developed atrial fibrillation when 65, 2 ablations were only temporary cures and for the last 19 years the advice has been "live with it"

Bought an e-bike 3 years ago and left the clubruns a year later. Became increasingly breathless 6 months ago and stopped riding. Diagnosed as fluid on the lungs "cured" by medication so am doing very short (12-15 mile) rides whilst waiting to see if a pacemaker is needed.

Have these miles caused the heart problems or are they the reason that I am still riding and otherwise in good health?

I would say that given that you've outlasted most of your cohort, and that those remaining are exceedingly unlikely to be able to ride 12-15 miles that you've done tremendously well. You're almost 50 years my senior and I hope very much to be still able to ride at your age.

All the best for the medical investigations and treatments.

[Carlton green]

I'm an 88 year old nerd who has recorded every mile since riding to school age 12, Have covered 371,000 miles including 43 years commuting over 10-32 miles a day, 500+ time trials between ages 19 to 63 with a 24 hour at 59 and 151 audax rides up to 600k between
ages 56 and 83.

Developed atrial fibrillation when 65, 2 ablations were only temporary cures and for the last 19 years the advice has been "live with it"

Bought an e-bike 3 years ago and left the clubruns a year later. Became increasingly breathless 6 months ago and stopped riding. Diagnosed as fluid on the lungs "cured" by medication so am doing very short (12-15 mile) rides whilst waiting to see if a pacemaker is needed.

Have these miles caused the heart problems or are they the reason that I am still riding and otherwise in good health?

Who’s to say what’s bad or not and, however well informed they are thought to be, is their judgment actually sound? There are so many variables and a general lack of adequate data plus personalised interpretation that it is, to my mind, darn near impossible to make anything other that an educated ‘best guess’.

If taking one aspirin is good for you and taking two is better again then surely taking twenty should be fantastic, but in reality it’s an overdose. Can one overdose on cycling and if so can it be harmful? I believe so and at times feel that I have overdone physical exercise. Can overexercise damage heath, I’d have thought so and that identifying the particular point at which exercise became harming (overexercise) would be hard to do … and certainly very personalised with a multitude of dynamic (moving) variables.

As far as I know the benefits of exercise aren’t linearly linked to amount but instead additional benefit diminishes with increased exercise. So my philosophy is to take exercise whilst listening to my body and maintaining a margin between what I’m doing and overly pushing myself - moderation in all things, etc.

In answer to your complex question I suspect that some of those miles are - at least in part- responsible for your problems and that others - at least in part - help you to manage your issues, but I claim no medical knowledge and am merely voicing observations.

[Audax67]

Part of the convalescence from my first stent was a month-long course on how to carry on afterwards. The main recommendation was to take up an endurance sport and stick with it. My old cardiologist once told me that, according to his observations, people who did that lived on average 10 years longer than those who didn't.

I just wish I knew when my 10 years were going to start. My father was a diabetic smoker who died a long time ago at 73; I don't smoke so he's no yardstick. Still, if I add 10 years to his score I've got a good wee while yet - as long as my new cardiologist doesn't **** me up with drugs I don't need.

[ANTONISH]

It seems to me that endurance exercise as such is probably good for ones health.
One aspect of long distance cycling (audax) is that for most participants at distances over 400k there is inevitably some sleep loss.
Some keen "audaxers" participate in such events ( and longer) on a weekly basis and some complete "permanents" as well as "calendar" events even more frequently - I'm not sure if the inevitable sleep deprivation is not harmful - similarly to shift work.
I can remember a desultory conversation on this at a control in the early morning hours when riding a 400k - basically "is what we are doing good for us ?" - the answer being "no" - not that it made any difference - I saw the same faces often in the following years.

[Audax67]

Part of the convalescence from my first stent was a month-long course on how to carry on afterwards. The main recommendation was to take up an endurance sport and stick with it. My old cardiologist once told me that, according to his observations, people who did that lived on average 10 years longer than those who didn't.

I just wish I knew when my 10 years were going to start. My father was a diabetic smoker who died a long time ago at 73; I don't smoke so he's no yardstick. Still, if I add 10 years to his score I've got a good wee while yet - as long as my new cardiologist doesn't **** me up with drugs I don't need.

[Chris Jeggo]

It seems entirely possible that endurance cycling damaged my heart.

I took up cycle-touring and joined the CTC in 1974. I joined Audax UK in 1979 and completed a Super Randonneur (SR) series in 1980. My second child was born towards the end of that year so family commitments meant that I never repeated that, although I did manage to fit in a few 200km events and a 400km in 1982. I kept up my cycling mileage, though, averaging 7000 miles per year, cycle-commuting plus club runs.

In 1987 I decided to prove that life begins at 40 by doing another SR series. Well, that didn't happen, mainly due to Achilles tendinitis, but I did manage four 200's and two 400's. That, however, was the year that I first experienced slow atrial fibrillation (AF). That first episode lasted only a few of tens of minutes, but it recurred a few months later.

Over the next few years the AF episodes gradually became longer and more frequent. 1992: started taking digoxin and a beta-blocker for heart rate control. 1994: the arrhythmia became permanent. 1995: cardioversion attempted but unsuccessful.

2010: echocardiogram showed heart rate somewhat fast and atria very large, so "warfarin is highly recommended". 2011: started taking anti-coagulants, warfarin at first, then edoxaban for the last few years. One cardiologist told me that my AF made my heart 30% less efficient, which I interpret as a 30% reduction in flow rate and hence in power, which is consistent with my average cycling speed dropping from 17mph to 13 or 14.

In recent years my annual mileage has averaged around 5000, but is now slowly declining thanks to anno domini. And I just keep taking the tablets.