Belts and chains

[Dr pepper]

I dont mean to open a can of works, but here goes.
I'm going to invest in a new bicycle, finally.
I commute 20 miles a day all year, on roads, bridle paths and a farm track.
I've had issues with chain, I've tried chains from cheap to around 40 quid, but it seems road salt in winter kills them, I go through 2 a year.
Considering this is a commuter and I'm not that concerned with speed, efficiency or weight would a belt drive be good for me.
I'm thinking about one of treks district series bikes.

[Jdsk]

Some background and experiences:
"Belt drive instead of chain..why? why not?":
viewtopic.php?t=133807

Jonathan

[mig]

does your current bike have decent mudguards with a lengthy front mudflap?

do you clean the chain regularly?

[freeflow]

Try a KMC ep1 coated chain. After 3+years and 20,000 km they still look like new.

[531colin]

I dont mean to open a can of works, but here goes.
I'm going to invest in a new bicycle, finally.
I commute 20 miles a day all year, on roads, bridle paths and a farm track.
I've had issues with chain, I've tried chains from cheap to around 40 quid, but it seems road salt in winter kills them, I go through 2 a year.
Considering this is a commuter and I'm not that concerned with speed, efficiency or weight would a belt drive be good for me.
I'm thinking about one of treks district series bikes.

I think a lot of what we call “wear” is in fact corrosion; certainly during a Yorkshire winter when they cover the roads in salt.
Now I’m retired and my only riding is recreational I avoid the cold and the salted roads, and transmission wear is much less.
When I was working I couldn’t always be bothered to attend to the bike in the cold and dark when I got home, so it wasn’t uncommon to drag the bike out of the shed in the morning to find the chain rusted into an “S”shape around the jockey wheels.
So to me, 2 chains in 5,000 mucky miles a year doesn’t seem too bad, particularly if changing the chain twice a year keeps the sprockets in good condition so a new chain doesn’t skip.

Some Trek District bikes have full chain case: but also a suspension fork!

[Brucey]

the problem is age-old and the solution is fairly simple too; just stop the chain from getting dirty in the first place. The first recourse is to fit better mudguards, chainguards and mudflaps. Here, you can often make something that works better than (or as well as) anything you can buy, so you can knock yourself out if you like. However a chaincase and perhaps an IGH are the ultimate solution IMV. A good chain inside a chaincase will last over 20000 miles IME and it will require very little maintenance along the way. Belt drives are (IMV) a bit 'faddy' by comparison.

[JohnR]

I used a belt drive bike through a winter and found that the bike started to make creaking noises. I couldn't find the source after weeks of checking that everything was tight. Then, at the end of winter I gave the belt a good scrub. The creaking noise immediately disappeared. My conclusion was that belts aren't as low maintenance as claimed given that I hadn't been off-road.

Another problem with belt drive is that if you ever want to adjust the overall gearing then you need to change two of chainring / belt / sprocket. Those parts aren't cheap!

[pjclinch]

Yes, belts creak when dirty... But chains stop going round corners if left for a couple of days after a salty ride.
I have mudguards/flaps and spend quite a bit of time cleaning and lubing, but on bikes that won't take a chain case well ( e.g, the Brom) I reckon to throw the chain away at the end of March most years when used on Dundee roads over winter.

My wife's Gazelle and her e-cargo trike have Gates belts, and they do a lot better than my chains over the winter. If available as a choice on something I wanted I'd personally choose a belt. While on the one hand, yes, a chain case works very well... on the other, so does a belt and then you don't need a chain case!

Pete.

[TrevA]

I’ve found that fitting SKS Longboard mudguards means much less muck and salt get thrown up onto the chain and bottom bracket area. When cleaning our bikes, mine has no dirt in the BB area, my wife’s bike with normal mudguards has a coating of muck around the BB shell.

[mig]

what is a typical price for a belt?

[rareposter]

what is a typical price for a belt?

CDN is about £70, the higher quality CDX is about £100.
But given that a belt will easily last 25,000km (bikepacking blogger Alee Denham reckons they have between 3x and 5x the life of a chain depending on conditions), it works out significantly cheaper in the long run.

Plus the only cleaning they need is an occasional squirt of water, there's never any need for degreaser, lubricant etc so that's another saving in both time and materials.

[Dr pepper]

I have mudguards, however the bike is always mucked up, I have 40mm tyres and 40mm mudguards, the trek 6000 doesnt have much space for wider ones. I do have mudflaps but as mentioned above though mank gets all over.
I clean the chain with a scrubber once a week and re-libe, there are times I dont, and yes sometimes I get rust forming but I've never had the chain seize into shape.
Noted about the kmc chain, even if I get a new ride I have the option to fit something like that on my old one as a backup.
IGH is something else I'd like to have as the derailleur is another source of trouble for me, mainly alignment.
I'd wondered if a chainhousing would be a benefit or a liability as if it were to get full of mank then chain issues would worsen, but it sounds like some of you guys have had good results.
More to think about when spending my hard earned.

[PT1029]

The key for mudguards/mud flaps keeping your chain/BB shell clean is to have a DIY mudflap that is long enough. My mudflaps just clear the ground, so no muck gets up to the chain (from the front wheel at least!).
Also has to be the right balance of stiffness (too rigid, muck splatters out sideways onto your feet, too pliable, wind blows it back and muck gets up to the BB shell/chain).
There is an old thread on here somewhere about DIY mudflaps.

Can someone answer the question I have. Belts need to be reasonably tight (I'm told) - what does this permanant tension do to BB/hub bearing life, or is such tension of minimal consequence to bearings?

[rareposter]

Can someone answer the question I have. Belts need to be reasonably tight (I'm told) - what does this permanant tension do to BB/hub bearing life, or is such tension of minimal consequence to bearings?

It depends a bit on the frame - stiffer frames you can get away with less belt tension.
Anyway, cartridge bearings on bikes fail due to grit ingress, not loads. Considering that 100 lb force on the pedals puts somewhere in the region of 200 lbf tension in the chain/belt, I think it's safe to say that static belt tension isn't going to make the slightest difference in bearing life.

It's one of those theoretical issues that crops up all the time - oh I've heard that belt tension is bad - but which in reality is either not an issue at all or is so slight in the grand scheme of things it's not a practical consideration.
Same with things like Di2, everyone goes "oh what if you run out of battery?!" It's one of those things that the internet feels obliged to ask every single time.

[Brucey]

Anyway, cartridge bearings on bikes fail due to grit ingress, not loads. Considering that 100 lb force on the pedals puts somewhere in the region of 200 lbf tension in the chain/belt, I think it's safe to say that static belt tension isn't going to make the slightest difference in bearing life.....

in theory this might be true, but in practice it isn't, mainly because on a bicycle, cartridge bearings do not often enjoy the conditions of use which work in their favour.. Belt-drive Moultons are fitted with a 'snubber' device which helps the belt to stay meshed correctly, even when the preload is probably too low. I have never seen a larger-wheeled bike fitted with such a thing, despite the obvious advantages it might bring.