Repairability and economic lifespan

Use this board for general non-cycling-related chat, or to introduce yourself to the forum.
axel_knutt
Posts: 3453
Joined: 11 Jan 2007, 12:20pm

Re: Repairability and economic lifespan

Post by axel_knutt »

Cowsham wrote: 14 Aug 2024, 3:59pm
axel_knutt wrote: 14 Aug 2024, 1:09pm
ossie wrote: 12 Aug 2024, 8:10pm I'm reaching the stage in life where man handling these things is becoming difficult due to a dodgy back, lack of room in the utility and just the thought that most of the cheap components probably have similar life span.
Last December the condenser on my washer dryer was blocked and needed clearing out, but my health is no longer good enough to do it, so I hired someone. I stood over them until I was satisfied they had diagnosed the fault correctly, then left them to it and went and sat down. Some time later they told me that they'd cleaned out the condenser but the fan was faulty as well, so they'd send a quote for that.

I knew there was nothing wrong with the fan so I took the lid off for a look after they'd gone, and found that they'd slashed through the motor windings with a Stanley knife:

.
WIN_20231212_13_49_26_Pro.jpg


That's fraud but how do you prove a thing like that?
I contacted the Which legal helpline at first, but then I dropped it and just bought a new machine, I can do without the stress.

According to Trustpilot they have two scams:

1) Tell the customer they can't find anything wrong so that they have to pay again for another callout next day.
2) Fix the fault then say they've found another, fix that then say they've found another....repeat as many times as customer's daft enough to let them.

I called them because I'd used them before, but in retrospect they were trying it on then too. On that occasion they told me that there was nothing wrong, but I insisted they renew the dampers anyway because I knew that's what was wrong.
“I'm not upset that you lied to me, I'm upset that from now on I can't believe you.”
― Friedrich Nietzsche
Biospace
Posts: 2809
Joined: 24 Jun 2019, 12:23pm

Re: Repairability and economic lifespan

Post by Biospace »

ossie wrote: 12 Aug 2024, 8:10pm
Biospace wrote: 12 Aug 2024, 7:49pm Around 20 years ago I bought what must have been the last of reasonably well built domestic washing machines, it lasted 12 years on top of the 3 when bought, without any work on it whatsoever, it was an Electrolux Lavamat, made by Zanussi iirc. It was still working perfectly when we gave it away on a house move :roll:
My parents had a Miele which lasted in excess of 20 years, I'm not sure of their reliability nowadays but I know my mums sheltered accommodation still use them.
...
I'm reaching the stage in life where man handling these things is becoming difficult due to a dodgy back, lack of room in the utility and just the thought that most of the cheap components probably have similar life span.
Miele still appear to have a good reputation for lasting well, but from what I can gather their servicing is in house and the necessary information/software is not open source, so with more modern machines you're trapped within their repair network with no competition.

However it's said that washing mostly at low temperatures causes all sorts of problems, so perhaps the simplest internals and a regular hot wash is the economical approach.

More positively, we've had a DeLonghi kettle which has worked perfectly for nearly 20 years. I'm happy with that lifespan for a washing machine or kettle, but I'd expect a fridge/freezer to last significantly longer.
Tangled Metal
Posts: 9695
Joined: 13 Feb 2015, 8:32pm

Re: Repairability and economic lifespan

Post by Tangled Metal »

My Mum's favourite vacuum is still a hoover Junior that is older than me. No longer in use because there are no longer any local shops who service and fix them. There used to be vacuum cleaner repair shops in virtually every town in the country but decades ago the brand started to make disposable instead.

Our Miele is still reliable, except it has a bit of a problem with it. The vacuum cleaner is simply too powerful! Our last house it would simply lift the carpet up in the lowest power setting. I have never had another tiny "cylinder" vacuum with an exhaust so powerful I finished vacuuming with a quiff from the exhaust airflow!! Wash my hair before vacuuming and it worked better than any proper hairdryer, including Dyson!!

BTW Morecambe saturday market has a stall selling miele vacuum bags 5 for the price of the cheapest you can get for one online, if not cheaper!! They do other brands and models too!!
User avatar
Cowsham
Posts: 5695
Joined: 4 Nov 2019, 1:33pm

Re: Repairability and economic lifespan

Post by Cowsham »

In and around 2015 I needed a thermostat for my 1440mm tall ( roughly -- an odd height compared to uk style fridges so the stat was an odd length ) built in Miele fridge --- shocked at the price around £130 ilrc. So I had to do a bit of shopping around and found one on eBay eu for about £25 delivered from Germany.

It lasted till we had a lightning strike in 2017 which fried the microprocessor board and toasted a lot of other electrical stuff.

A new Miele fridge was £1100 but I'd had enough of Miele by that time and bought a much simpler but prettier stand alone fridge and redesigned the kitchen to suit.
Last edited by Cowsham on 16 Aug 2024, 10:44pm, edited 1 time in total.
I am here. Where are you?
axel_knutt
Posts: 3453
Joined: 11 Jan 2007, 12:20pm

Re: Repairability and economic lifespan

Post by axel_knutt »

My last fridge was a Coop own brand, and lasted 43 years. The current one is a Zanussi, and 11 years old.
“I'm not upset that you lied to me, I'm upset that from now on I can't believe you.”
― Friedrich Nietzsche
rjb
Posts: 7728
Joined: 11 Jan 2007, 10:25am
Location: Somerset (originally 60/70's Plymouth)

Re: Repairability and economic lifespan

Post by rjb »

Newer fridges and freezers are significantly more energy efficient. Our old built in fridge freezer which came with the house so approx 15 years old used twice as much electricity than a new replacement. As it runs 24/7 we saved approx £100 a year off our bill, so after 2 years it paid for itself. :wink:
At the last count:- Peugeot 531 pro, Dawes Discovery Tandem, Dawes Kingpin X3, Raleigh 20 stowaway X2, 1965 Moulton deluxe, Falcon K2 MTB dropped bar tourer, Rudge Bi frame folder, Longstaff trike conversion on a Giant XTC 840 :D
Biospace
Posts: 2809
Joined: 24 Jun 2019, 12:23pm

Re: Repairability and economic lifespan

Post by Biospace »

rjb wrote: 16 Aug 2024, 9:43pm Newer fridges and freezers are significantly more energy efficient.
They are, but their life expectancy has been reducing.

Is this mirrored in other products, I wonder?

And how short would the life of a fridge have to be for its reduced emissions during operation to be cancelled out?
reohn2
Posts: 45807
Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: Repairability and economic lifespan

Post by reohn2 »

Currently scrapping a 25 year old Creda Tumble dryer because the diecast door hinge broke and it's a discontinued part,otherwise a perfectly good dryer 🤨
And a 7 year old Samsung tablet due to an unfixable software issue🤨
-----------------------------------------------------------
"All we are not stares back at what we are"
W H Auden
User avatar
Cugel
Posts: 6256
Joined: 13 Nov 2017, 11:14am

Re: Repairability and economic lifespan

Post by Cugel »

reohn2 wrote: 24 Aug 2024, 5:28pm Currently scrapping a 25 year old Creda Tumble dryer because the diecast door hinge broke and it's a discontinued part,otherwise a perfectly good dryer 🤨
And a 7 year old Samsung tablet due to an unfixable software issue🤨
Today I scrapped two shoe inserts as doing the thousands of miles dog walking in 'em had worn holes-in-the-soles. I did think of patching them with a bit of old horsehair from a Georgian chair that even our good friend The Georgian could no longer bear to perch upon but I feared Cadi the collie might be forever tripping me up as she sniffed suspiciously at me feet. I put some new foam & leather inserts in.

Those shoes themselves are still going though - 16 years of dog walking at an average of, say, 4 miles a day = 23,360 miles. Looking at the things with a critical eye I reckon they have at least another 5,000 miles in them. Clarks leather walking shoes, if you're interested. They won't tumble dry your clothes, though - in fact they can make your socks quite damp.
“Practical men who believe themselves to be quite exempt from any intellectual influence are usually the slaves of some defunct economist”.
John Maynard Keynes
axel_knutt
Posts: 3453
Joined: 11 Jan 2007, 12:20pm

Re: Repairability and economic lifespan

Post by axel_knutt »

I've repaired quite a lot of training shoes, I salvage the unworn rubber off the soles of an old pair and use it to patch the holes in another pair. It's mostly motivated by the difficulty in finding suitable trainers rather than saving money though.
“I'm not upset that you lied to me, I'm upset that from now on I can't believe you.”
― Friedrich Nietzsche
User avatar
Cugel
Posts: 6256
Joined: 13 Nov 2017, 11:14am

Re: Repairability and economic lifespan

Post by Cugel »

axel_knutt wrote: 24 Aug 2024, 7:54pm I've repaired quite a lot of training shoes, I salvage the unworn rubber off the soles of an old pair and use it to patch the holes in another pair. It's mostly motivated by the difficulty in finding suitable trainers rather than saving money though.
I myself am motivated by a natural sense of economy AKA being a skinflint. Also, I enjoy looking a bit tramp-like as a counterpoint to the many fashion victims going about. They curl a lip at my unkempt whilst I chuckle at their outlandish latestlook.
“Practical men who believe themselves to be quite exempt from any intellectual influence are usually the slaves of some defunct economist”.
John Maynard Keynes
reohn2
Posts: 45807
Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: Repairability and economic lifespan

Post by reohn2 »

Cugel
I see your dilemma and feel your pain

PS,it's always worth remembering the old adage "it's not the habit that maketh the monk" which I feel sure applies to shoes,trainers or even sandals
-----------------------------------------------------------
"All we are not stares back at what we are"
W H Auden
User avatar
Cugel
Posts: 6256
Joined: 13 Nov 2017, 11:14am

Re: Repairability and economic lifespan

Post by Cugel »

reohn2 wrote: 24 Aug 2024, 10:34pm Cugel
I see your dilemma and feel your pain

PS,it's always worth remembering the old adage "it's not the habit that maketh the monk" which I feel sure applies to shoes,trainers or even sandals
Yet many monks had (and some still have) bad habits that make up a goodly (I mean badly) part of their character. We cannot list these habits here as they would probably give even the calloused eye of a moderator an awful shock! However, we might mention Caldey Island and Stonyhurst college as locations where certain monk habits could be found that will illustrate the case.

In former times, when monasteries and their monks were not only everywhere but a large authority in the land, things could get very unhealthy or even (according to that Luther) devilish. A large literature in which monks of both good and awful habits perform various antics on a regular basis can be found. as a result.

************
These days there are many habits of the apparel ilk, as the neolibs gain their own particular power by freeing us all to have immense choices rather than, as with an abbot, attempting to confine us to one garb and one set of behaviours. Of course these choices are not that freely made as the various neolib "abbots" wish us to adopt their particular habits and associated accoutrements rather than those of the other abbots. We have their various dogmas (now known as adverts) thrust into our eyes and ears every 3 seconds, if we allow them.

Folk start arguing about whether Pepsi or Coke is better - the modern equivalent of arguing about how many angels can dance on the head of a pin. There are also fanboy wars concerning hats, cameras and everything, including what to wear when cycling to best effect on the opinions of others about our worth.

Myself, I try to be agnostic, or even irreligious, concerning the various accoutrements that supposedly will save me, redeem me or guarantee that I'll go to neolib heaven (a large shop where everyone admires what one buys). It's no easy matter! I find myself buying things anyway, with the secret feeling that other will then think me a canny shopper.

Being something of a skinflint, though, I prefer to buy fancy tools to fix other things, rather than the things. This leads inevitably to the buying of tools to make other tools and to fix non-working tools.

Would you like to buy a woodworking plane? I have so many and no more space to put a new cupboard to contain the excess! I hear that this can happen also to cyclists, who are forever expanding their bike shed; and sometimes finding a bike in there that they haven't seen since 1963.
“Practical men who believe themselves to be quite exempt from any intellectual influence are usually the slaves of some defunct economist”.
John Maynard Keynes
Biospace
Posts: 2809
Joined: 24 Jun 2019, 12:23pm

Re: Repairability and economic lifespan

Post by Biospace »

Cugel wrote: 25 Aug 2024, 9:26am ...
Being something of a skinflint, though, I prefer to buy fancy tools to fix other things, rather than the things. This leads inevitably to the buying of tools to make other tools and to fix non-working tools.
...
Buying tools is one of the pleasures of life, using and maintaining them properly even more rewarding. I once started up a business through having a whole host of special tools I'd bought which were under-employed, it was a very satisfying to use them lots.
reohn2
Posts: 45807
Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: Repairability and economic lifespan

Post by reohn2 »

Cugel
I'm sure you knew what I meant,but hey ho any excuse for a long rambling post,eh?😉😊
-----------------------------------------------------------
"All we are not stares back at what we are"
W H Auden
Post Reply