Does reach on drop bars change handling?

[thps]

Lets say you change your bar from something long like 90mm to 70mm reach, but you move the seat 20mm back, so the stretched position stays the same. will this affect the handling in any way when riding on hoods?

[pwa]

Two things there. Firstly, I have found that putting a short handlebar stem on a touring bike (so a bike with very steady handling) worked okay. The bike still steered nicely.

Secondly, moving a saddle back can make your steering twitchy. And it is a bad idea to muck about with your saddle position when all you want to do is alter reach to the bars. Only change your saddle position if you feel that your seat is in the wrong place.

The rule is, get your bottom in the right place. Then find a handlebar stem that gives the correct reach from saddle to bars. In that order.

[thps]

to clarify, when I said "reach" I wasnt talking about stem length. I ment that particular number on dropbars that shows you how far the bent part is away from the tops. sorry if that was misleadimg.

when leaving the saddle in the current position, I have to get a longer stem in order to keep the stretched position that I currently have (and like). this should compensate the reach reduction of the shorter bar and handling should be about the same, correct?

[Nearholmer]

I think you’re right, because what affects posture, and steering “feel” is how far forward of the centreline of the steerer your hands are …….. assuming that the old and new bars are the same width.

If the width of the bars are different, you need to factor that in too. If the new are shorter reach, but noticeably wider, you may be OK with the same stem length as the old.

[Barrowman]

I have always thought that a Stem is in fact a lever. Longer stem : longer lever.
(Obviously the body doesn't want to be over extended. )

[thps]

assuming that the old and new bars are the same width.

new bars would probably be 20mm narrower. however I feel going another stem size up (so +10mm for most models) to compensate that would be too much. It might then feel too slow.

[531colin]

Lets say you change your bar from something long like 90mm to 70mm reach, but you move the seat 20mm back, so the stretched position stays the same. will this affect the handling in any way when riding on hoods?

Question; with the bike as it is (or with any bike) what difference in steering feel do you notice when you move your hands between tops, hoods and drops?

I can’t say I have ever noticed any difference, and that being the case I wouldn’t worry about the steering feel at all.
If you move your hands say 100mm back, (edit; from the tops position) you will alter weight distribution and this will make the steering light.

But as already said, saddle position should be set to pedal comfortably and also to balance your weight front to back, so you aren’t propping up your torso on your arms.

My DIY bike fit linked below is really aimed at recreational riders rather than racing cyclists; might be worth a look.

[Cugel]

Question; with the bike as it is (or with any bike) what difference in steering feel do you notice when you move your hands between tops, hoods and drops?

I can’t say I have ever noticed any difference, and that being the case I wouldn’t worry about the steering feel at all.

This is the right answer.

We don't steer a bike with the handlebars, we steer it with lean and various other whole body movements. Many can ride anywhere with hands-off the bars, steering around bends, over cambers and so forth entirely with body movements and positions. As long as there's nothing in the road to wrench the front wheel away from the path one has selected by use of body-steering, the handlebars are not really necessary for steering.

So what are the bars for? They contain controls; they give a resting place for leant-forward upper body weight; they auto-place our body into a desirable (comfortable, aerodynamic) position. They're handy for stopping road-blebs from wrenching the front wheel out of the body-steered path, especially with twitchy-steering frame & fork designs as usually found in racing.

****************
Over the past three decades I've gradually assumed a more and more upright position by selecting shorter and higher rise steams, as well as frames with a longer/taller head tube. This makes me less aerodynamic than I was in my racing days but much more comfortable (far less back, neck & shoulder ache) as I grow older. I've never changed the fore-back seat position, although I have gradually lowered it a centimetre as I get less stretchy i' the legs with age.

Me bikes still steer as they always did, which involves no significant pulling or other tugs at the handlebars.

[cycleruk]

I had a set of "compact" bars on a bike and felt no real 'reach' difference when moving from hoods to tops to drops.
Swapped back to standard bars so that at least went a bit more aero when on hoods and drops.
Didn't notice any change in handling.

I did fit a shorter stem to another bike and that did feel twitchier so swapped back.

[axel_knutt]

Shortening the stem on my Horizon makes the steering both twitchy and prone to shimmy.

[CyberKnight]

Nothing you wont be able to compensate for within a couple of minutes, i have ridden bikes with stems ranging from 70 to 110 mm and notice no real difference that i would feel unsafe with and i have never experienced over light/heavy steering or twitchiness .

[Bmblbzzz]

I have always thought that a Stem is in fact a lever. Longer stem : longer lever.
(Obviously the body doesn't want to be over extended. )

Question; with the bike as it is (or with any bike) what difference in steering feel do you notice when you move your hands between tops, hoods and drops?

This and this. The lever is from wherever your hands are to wherever the stem joins the steerer tube. What's inbetween is merely there to join the dots.

[pjclinch]

Nothing you wont be able to compensate for within a couple of minutes, i have ridden bikes with stems ranging from 70 to 110 mm and notice no real difference that i would feel unsafe with and i have never experienced over light/heavy steering or twitchiness .

I suspect this may vary according to the degree to which one steers with the body rather than directly turning the bars with hands. If you lean a bike over the forks will turn naturally and I imagine this doesn't really change with how long the stem is, but if your main steering input is through turning the bars then I'd guess stem length will have more bearing.

Even though they're holding the bars, 'cross riders who are very good in soft sand tend to be those who are good no-hands riders, i.e., used to steering significantly with their hips rather than their arms. I find I can get a bike handling subjectively better the less I try and use the bars to steer.

see the following, particularly at 2:00 minutes...


Pete.

[Nearholmer]

On drops, if I’m riding on roads, I never notice steering at all, and even off-road, where there are often things to avoid, I tend to look where I want to go, and the bike mysteriously knows that’s where it’s meant to head, no conscious steering. It’s only in really tight obstructions, where I’m down to walking pace and turning the bars very markedly, that I notice the action. Riding with swept-backs is rather different, the steering action becomes more noticeable, and it took me a while to get used to steering my swept-back bike by hip movements.

[531colin]

On drops, if I’m riding on roads, I never notice steering at all, and even off-road, where there are often things to avoid, I tend to look where I want to go, and the bike mysteriously knows that’s where it’s meant to head, no conscious steering. It’s only in really tight obstructions, where I’m down to walking pace and turning the bars very markedly, that I notice the action. Riding with swept-backs is rather different, the steering action becomes more noticeable, and it took me a while to get used to steering my swept-back bike by hip movements.

I have no real experience with swept-back bars, but Nearholmers experience mirrors my findings riding on and off road with drops and latterly bullbars which mimic my old “hoods” position. I tell people two things;
1: look far enough up the road/trail to give yourself time to pick your way around the biggest obstacle, go over the small bumps if necessary to avoid the big ones.
2: don’t look at the obstacle, because if you do you will hit it, so instead concentrate on your path round the obstacle.

At low speeds I am aware of turning the bars much more than at normal riding speeds, both to balance the bike and to steer round things. Fair to say I can turn more sharply at slow speeds.