Police ever been helpful?

[Galaxy-Tourer]

It's a serious question: I am wondering if any cyclist has ever found the police to be helpful, ie "on their side"

I have had cause to involve the police on 5 occasions that I can recall over 20 years, and only once have I found them willing to do ANYTHING (but in fact, they may have fobbed me off about having "had a word" with a dangerous aggressive driver).

Yesterday I was in a very near miss with a sporty hatchback that decided to move me, rather than wait behind me (she overtook me on a bend, at speed, on the wrong side of the road, then drove alongside while "pushing" me to the kerb. I was turning right at a roundabout, she was turning left: but she overtook me on the outside. Actually, not even on the outside - she went to the wrong side of the road to overtake me.

I was, perhaps understandably, incensed, and rode straight to the police station, told my story twice over an hour, only to be told "there's nothing we can do ... your word against hers, see".


So, is it a conspiracy, or are the police really out to get us?

[gaz]

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[Si]

The police man that (accidently) ran me down was most helpful (afterwards) - he made sure that his insurance company didn't fight my claim and he admitted full responsibility. I think that he even called the local police to the incident and told them it was his fault.

[Galaxy-Tourer]

That evening I received a phone call to say "we went round to see the driver and had a word or two with him about why he shouldn't let his passenger behave like that, or in other words we gave him a damn good **!!@!!%**@!. We hope that's satisfacory for you."

Do you think they actually did bother to speak to him?
Because I am beginning to suspect this is in the handbook of "How to Fob Off Cyclists".

[ianr1950]

I have never been able to find a police person or a police station open when I have wanted one.

Seen quite a few PCSOs standing next to the burger van in Melton Mowbray market square ignoring cyclists cycling in the pedestrian zone mind you.

[plod]

As both a cyclist and a cop I'd like to think that I've been helpful to any cyclist I've had dealings with. Firstly cycle accidents are very rare. Off hand I can think of only 4 injury cycle accidents I've dealt with over the last couple of decades.
1. Kids bike, brakes so out of adjustment they didn't work. Minor injuries after hitting the side of a passing car.
2 Faulty brakes caused teenage cyclist wearing helmet to lose control and hit tree. Serious head injuries.
3 Experienced touring cyclist knocked off by overtaking car whose mirror clipped her arm. Broken arm. Driver charged - careless driving.
4 Cyclist knocked off by car pulling out from side street. Bruising, cuts, nothing broken, Bike damaged. Cyclist declined to attend at the station to give a statement so I could charge the driver.

Near misses. Almost nil reported. One where I warned the driver. The difficulty is that it usually is one persons word against another. It is of limited value tracing a driver to warn them when if they deny committing any offence you don't have the evidence behind you to then charge them.

A warning is pretty useless where the matter in question is denied by the driver. In fact if a counter allegation is made then it just gets into a he said, she said situation.

[kwackers]

A warning is pretty useless where the matter in question is denied by the driver. In fact if a counter allegation is made then it just gets into a he said, she said situation.

Evenin' (and welcome to the forums).

Just out of interest then - how useful would video footage from a helmet camera be?

[hubgearfreak]

I was, perhaps understandably, incensed, and rode straight to the police station, told my story twice over an hour, only to be told "there's nothing we can do ... your word against hers, see".

it's frustrating, but they'd be wasting taxpayers money chasing someone down without a fair chance of a conviction. and we don't want to have convictions for anything without an amount of evidence that would prove the prosecutors case beyond all reasonable doubt.

anything else would mean we have the prisons would be stuffed full of innocent people, maybe even us if we fitted the description of an armed robber or rapist, etc.

they may seem useless, but what can they do?

i'd be interested to know whether the police you spoke to were polite and prompt, or rude and deliberately kept you waiting as once happened to me.

[DavidT]

Just over a year ago I once again took my IAM (Institute of Advanced Motorists) refresher drive, to keep myself up to date.

Amongst a few things, the Police Officer who took the "test" picked me up on not doing shoulder checks before moving off from stationary at traffic lights in case cyclists or motorcyclists had entered my blind spot. (He didn't know I was a cyclist, and I was privately a bit embarrassed - although that's why you do refresher training I guess!)

He being a fully fledged "Traffic Cop", I was, as ever, reassured that they are not out to get us, and to the contrary are very well motivated towards road safety of all road users. This has been consistent over my near 20 years exposure to IAM principles, much of which has had a Police involvement.

Perhaps I am naive, but i can only speak from experience.

As regards to their attitudes to dealing with actual issues, I have no experience as a cyclist.

[Galaxy-Tourer]

Near misses. Almost nil reported. One where I warned the driver. The difficulty is that it usually is one persons word against another.

Perhaps we don't bother reporting Near Misses, because of this attitude?
My point of view is that "the authorities" don't think there is a problem (with aggressive drivers) unless such incidents are reported.

Having a "chat" with an errant driver may not result in a conviction, but they will surely feel caught out, and a little guilty? And perhaps may rethink their attitude towards cyclists?

If we do nothing, they get away with it. Time and again.

[Galaxy-Tourer]

they may seem useless, but what can they do?

What they do, the over-stretched police force, is wait to catch cyclists riding through the town on a "no vehicle" section of street that was previously open to cyclists.

Am I just being a victim?

Or is there real injustice in this? Dangerous drivers get let off, but cyclists just trying to get safely to work are cautioned.

[gaz]

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[thirdcrank]

Apart from any issues of evidence, it is my own experience that a lot of people who report stuff to the police do not want to 'get involved.' This means that they expect the police to do something without even being prepared themselves to give evidence if necessary. Getting the statement form out shuts a lot of people up. This is an aspect that people do not mention when they hammer on about the police doing nothing. The invention of the mobile phone has been a contributory factor because a lot of the irate calling comes in the heat of the moment. This is all before any consideration of whether the CPS or a court would accept uncorroborated evidence.

I do not suggest this is easy - there are many cases where a victim of crime is vulnerable to retribution and is genuinely and reasonably afraid to give evidence. I think it is fair to say that the system has been very slow to recognise this. There has been a growing problem over the last 30 - 40 years of witnesses making a statement and then withdrawing. Initially, the legal establishment put this all down to the police pressuring witnesses into making statements that they would not repeat at court under oath. In fact, a series of developments, including witness statements bearing the witness's name and address being served on the defence, much greater use of bail, cases taking months, even years to come to trial, rather than a few weeks at the most, have all increased the risk that witnesses will be intimidated. There have been limited reforms, like witnesses' addresses going on the back of the statement for and not being supplied to the defence. I think it is also true that when witnesses have turned to the police for help, the police have been slow to react. Witness protection schemes are expensive and only available in a very limited number of serious cases.

Even without intimidation, being a prosecution witness is not easy. Even independent witnesses - people who inconvenience themselves to perform a public service, and on whom the entire legal system depends heavily, are treated in away which makes them feeled they are being accused of lying. The reason for this is that a truly independent witness's evidence carries such weight that the defence has to undermine it or lose the case. This is not something that people with no court experience take kindly to - the rate of not 'getting involved' must be even higher among people who have been a witness before, as in 'once bitten.'

There are no doubt lazy police officers, but I think there are many more who understand the futility of flogging a dead horse.

[meic]

It is not really a conspiracy against cyclists, you will get the same response if reporting an incident while driving or motorcycling.
There is one big difference they will consider a report from a motorist as a more serious event than an incident from a cyclist as cycling is a pretty "petty" thing.

I did have trouble repeatedly from the same HGV driver and after a visit from the Police he accepted a caution!!!! He now passes me with the same gap as the other motorists (2 feet) as compared to his previous 6".

My idea is to save visiting the Police untill you have a repeat offender who really stands out from the crowd or a very good case ready made for them.

[thirdcrank]

they will consider a report from a motorist as a more serious event than an incident from a cyclist

I'd be interested to know what you base that on - I'm not saying you are wrong, because I don't know. I think that a lot of motorists have been less than pleased when they have been unable to get the police to take an interest in their complaints about the bahaviour of other road users. I imagine it's probably correct to say that some decisions on action are based on inappropriate snap judgments but I'd guess - nothing more than instinct - that this can work in either direction.