Posted: 7 Feb 2007, 4:44pm
Winter bike Shimano. Best winter bike fixed. Summer bike Campag. But do any other old gits like me remember Zeus, the Spanish? Campag (almost) lookalike.
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"I'd Rather Walk than use Shimano"?
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Posted: 8 Feb 2007, 3:31pm
<Spam post and subsequent warning posts removed to keep thread tidy.>
Posted: 10 Feb 2007, 1:48pm
Have a look on the 'Bikes and Bits - Technical section' subject on this webb-site, and on the topic headed "Shimano Front Changers" - I've been having a problem, and the comments may be relevant.
Benelux gears? Its not helpful to compare them with current offerings, they were before the days of triples and dinner plate sprockets, but in their day, and compared with others on the market at the time, were there anything better? The first multi-geared lash up that I could afford (1964 ish) was around a Benelux P2 parallelogram rear mech, with accessible ball bearing jockey wheels. The body was pressed steel unfortunately, but it was only last year that I passed it on to a bygone bikes enthusiast, and it still works. I was riding 14-24 5 speed blocks at the time, and it was faultless. The only fault was the piviot bolt on the lever, which kept loosening.
I still have a Campag Nuovo Record from about 1976, in regular use on 42-52, 14-28, it has no sign of wear and operates faultlessly. I replace jockey wheels every 7 or 8 thousand miles, depending on weather conditions.
I had a Shimano Crane at about the same time, and that operated faultlessly also, but didn't have anything like the longevity of the Campag.
My experience with more recent Shimano rear chagers has been fine - I still have a 105 from 10 or more years ago.
JohnW
Benelux gears? Its not helpful to compare them with current offerings, they were before the days of triples and dinner plate sprockets, but in their day, and compared with others on the market at the time, were there anything better? The first multi-geared lash up that I could afford (1964 ish) was around a Benelux P2 parallelogram rear mech, with accessible ball bearing jockey wheels. The body was pressed steel unfortunately, but it was only last year that I passed it on to a bygone bikes enthusiast, and it still works. I was riding 14-24 5 speed blocks at the time, and it was faultless. The only fault was the piviot bolt on the lever, which kept loosening.
I still have a Campag Nuovo Record from about 1976, in regular use on 42-52, 14-28, it has no sign of wear and operates faultlessly. I replace jockey wheels every 7 or 8 thousand miles, depending on weather conditions.
I had a Shimano Crane at about the same time, and that operated faultlessly also, but didn't have anything like the longevity of the Campag.
My experience with more recent Shimano rear chagers has been fine - I still have a 105 from 10 or more years ago.
JohnW
Posted: 10 Feb 2007, 6:59pm
15 years ago I left the CTC because of the snobbish attitude of members - anti-shimano, anti-technology,anti-lycra, anti-MTB etc, etc... Seemingly everything they were against has been a success. Back then they were extolling the vitues of Suntour over shimano and look what happened to Suntour. It's disappointing to see not much has changed.
Posted: 10 Feb 2007, 7:58pm
mrh wrote:15 years ago I left the CTC because of the snobbish attitude of members - anti-shimano, anti-technology,anti-lycra, anti-MTB etc, etc... Seemingly everything they were against has been a success. Back then they were extolling the vitues of Suntour over shimano and look what happened to Suntour. It's disappointing to see not much has changed.
I'm sorry that you feel like that. Taking the broader view I do believe that CTC is changing and evolving both at a staff & membership level.
Technology-wise - beginning to embrace the internet and all its possibilities.
Developing, promoting & protecting cycling - through the new National Standard Cycling Training scheme, Campaigning and other activities
There are two new officers : Off-road campaigning & Off-road activities.
etc.
I wear lycra, Gore-tex Windstopper & Goretex. . . . ride road & MTB . . shimano & shimergo. . . .er, like all the other staff & members that I know.
There is a whole mix of people. Are they not represented on this forum ??
Posted: 10 Feb 2007, 9:16pm
I started this thread after 'surfing' and finding an American website/forum with a member signing off as "I'd rather walk than ShimaNO".
The thread was very anti Shimano of course, and I found it interesting to see how some people can be so biased and entrenched in rivalry.
I'm a Campagnolo fan. Always have been, I suppose, but I'm not closed to other stuff!
I started this thread to start a discussion. It worked!
Mick F. Cornwall
The thread was very anti Shimano of course, and I found it interesting to see how some people can be so biased and entrenched in rivalry.
I'm a Campagnolo fan. Always have been, I suppose, but I'm not closed to other stuff!
I started this thread to start a discussion. It worked!
Mick F. Cornwall
Posted: 22 Feb 2007, 9:54am
I have Campagnolo on my winter bike and Shimano on my other bikes (road, TT, city/shopper, and hack mtb). The groupset on my winter bike is Mirage 9-speed (2004). It works fine, if a bit agriculturally, though I don't like the plastic brake levers on the Ergos and will change them for Veloce when I get round to it. I found the brakes weak, even after much playing around with setup, alternative blocks, etc. As i wanted a bit more clearance for the 'guards, I eventually changed them for Tektro medium-drop brakes. No better performance (a bit 'grabby'), but quieter without the tyre rub!
The Shimano groupsets vary from an old SIS 5-speed on the hack mtb, via Alivio on the city bike, 105 on the TT (with DA shifters) and Ultegra 10-speed on the 'posh' road bike. All work very well indeed - even the 20-year-old SIS system! OK, it's a bit clunky, but nothing's worn out and it does what it's supposed to. The Alivio 'set is surprisingly smooth for such a cheap groupset, and Ultegra is sublime. I love the DA bar-end shifters on the TT bike; they feel deliciously precise and mechanical.
Conclusion? The technology is very good in all these systems, though I would suggest that the compromises Campag made in the Mirage 'set to keep the priice down weren't too clever. I believe they have addressed that now. Looked after, there's no reason why any of them shouldn't work indefinitely. So, in the end, it comes down to price, looks, and feel. Price no object, I prefer the looks and feel of the top-end Shimano kit - but I wouldn't be so po-faced as to make a big thing about it!
The Shimano groupsets vary from an old SIS 5-speed on the hack mtb, via Alivio on the city bike, 105 on the TT (with DA shifters) and Ultegra 10-speed on the 'posh' road bike. All work very well indeed - even the 20-year-old SIS system! OK, it's a bit clunky, but nothing's worn out and it does what it's supposed to. The Alivio 'set is surprisingly smooth for such a cheap groupset, and Ultegra is sublime. I love the DA bar-end shifters on the TT bike; they feel deliciously precise and mechanical.
Conclusion? The technology is very good in all these systems, though I would suggest that the compromises Campag made in the Mirage 'set to keep the priice down weren't too clever. I believe they have addressed that now. Looked after, there's no reason why any of them shouldn't work indefinitely. So, in the end, it comes down to price, looks, and feel. Price no object, I prefer the looks and feel of the top-end Shimano kit - but I wouldn't be so po-faced as to make a big thing about it!
Posted: 22 Feb 2007, 11:11am
TimC wrote:The groupset on my winter bike is Mirage 9-speed ... though I don't like the plastic brake levers on the Ergos
I love those levers - they aren't cold on your hands when you come back to the bike in Winter.
The "Carbon" levers are mostly plastic. The Mirage just don't have the decorative weave
Posted: 22 Feb 2007, 11:42am
Jimbo wrote:TimC wrote:The groupset on my winter bike is Mirage 9-speed ... though I don't like the plastic brake levers on the Ergos
I love those levers - they aren't cold on your hands when you come back to the bike in Winter.
The "Carbon" levers are mostly plastic. The Mirage just don't have the decorative weave
Yep sooner or later the penny will drop that its only the cloth thats carbon the stuff its stuck together with is plastic,oh the power of marketing.and foolishness of fashion.
Posted: 22 Feb 2007, 11:56am
I saw a bike yesterday with plastic moulded cranks.
Could'nt stop to examine it in detail - out shoping with my other half and he doesent like me stoping to admire bikes.
Could'nt stop to examine it in detail - out shoping with my other half and he doesent like me stoping to admire bikes.
Posted: 22 Feb 2007, 4:49pm
Jac wrote:I saw a bike yesterday with plastic moulded cranks.
Could'nt stop to examine it in detail - out shoping with my other half and he doesent like me stoping to admire bikes.
Jac
wot kind of a man would stop you doing that! has he no sense of whats wothwile in this life, tut tut.
Posted: 22 Feb 2007, 5:20pm
I'm intrigued that in all this talk of alternatives to Campagnolo/Shimano, no one has mentioned the TA Cyclotouriste, or Stronglight crank version of same, as an excellent touring chainset.
Sadly the availability of cheap MTB chainsets seems to have been the death of this excellent and versatile design.
Lisa
Sadly the availability of cheap MTB chainsets seems to have been the death of this excellent and versatile design.
Lisa