After the Vote

[Si]

Depends what you mean by 'vengeful voting'. If you mean voting for an alternative candidate (in the next council election) because you don't think a certain person represents you then I don't see anything at all wrong with that. If, on the other hand, you mean that you'd vote to defeat future AGM motions even if they were good for the CTC, just to 'get your own back' against someone, then I'd suggest that that was cutting off your nose to spite your face.

[PW]

The former. If I disagree with a club officer's actions I'm entitled to oppose their re-election.

[irc]

I'll not be renewing membership unless there is a no vote. I don't like the tactics the Trust have used. I want to be a member of a club not a contributer to a charity looking for govt contracts.

In my case none of the benefits are deal breakers. I work a lot of Sundays so I don't go on club rides. The mag is OK but I'll live without it. The insurance was nice to have but I don't need it.

I joined the CTC mainly to to be part of a club representing cyclists. I think that is compromised when they need contracts from the govt. I don't agree with the unfair way the "No" voices have been treated.

[leftpoole]

I'll not be renewing membership unless there is a no vote. I don't like the tactics the Trust have used. I want to be a member of a club not a contributer to a charity looking for govt contracts.

In my case none of the benefits are deal breakers. I work a lot of Sundays so I don't go on club rides. The mag is OK but I'll live without it. The insurance was nice to have but I don't need it.

I joined the CTC mainly to to be part of a club representing cyclists. I think that is compromised when they need contracts from the govt. I don't agree with the unfair way the "No" voices have been treated.

Hello
I am in absolute full agreement with this. Why are we as members not given a real chance to oppose or indeed have a say unless on here? We cannot be expected to travel to AGM surely? This is why those who will say yes win every time as they are manipulating CTC to their way-NOT- the real Members.
CTC should open its collective eyes and smell the cofee!
John.

[Regulator]

I'll not be renewing membership unless there is a no vote. I don't like the tactics the Trust have used. I want to be a member of a club not a contributer to a charity looking for govt contracts.

In my case none of the benefits are deal breakers. I work a lot of Sundays so I don't go on club rides. The mag is OK but I'll live without it. The insurance was nice to have but I don't need it.

I joined the CTC mainly to to be part of a club representing cyclists. I think that is compromised when they need contracts from the govt. I don't agree with the unfair way the "No" voices have been treated.

Hello
I am in absolute full agreement with this. Why are we as members not given a real chance to oppose or indeed have a say unless on here? We cannot be expected to travel to AGM surely? This is why those who will say yes win every time as they are manipulating CTC to their way-NOT- the real Members.
CTC should open its collective eyes and smell the cofee!
John.

Hi John

If you can't attend the AGM then make sure you use your proxy vote. That way you will have a real chance to oppose and have a say.

[thirdcrank]

...If you can't attend the AGM then make sure you use your proxy vote. That way you will have a real chance to oppose and have a say.

And at the risk of stating the hemorrhaging obvious, be careful how you complete the form. If you don't specifically nominate a proxy and leave the choices blank, you are as good as voting 'yes.' If you do want to vote 'no' mark the 'no' boxes and nominate a committed 'no' voting proxy (as listed on the savethectc site.) That covers the possibility of a trojan horse arriving on the agenda under the cover of darkness.

[byegad]

For me it may well be a step too far. I nearly didn't renew last time and this could well be the proverbial straw. I'm already appalled at the amount of my subscription spent on what to my mind are none core issues.

[workhard]

...If you can't attend the AGM then make sure you use your proxy vote. That way you will have a real chance to oppose and have a say.

And at the risk of stating the hemorrhaging obvious, be careful how you complete the form. If you don't specifically nominate a proxy and leave the choices blank, you are as good as voting 'yes.' If you do want to vote 'no' mark the 'no' boxes and nominate a committed 'no' voting proxy (as listed on the savethectc site.) That covers the possibility of a trojan horse arriving on the agenda under the cover of darkness.

Surely a yay sayer armed with a bunch of explicitly no papers, duly received and recorded as such by ERS, would be guilty of a serious breach of trust and due process if they did not apply these votes accordingly?

[Regulator]

...If you can't attend the AGM then make sure you use your proxy vote. That way you will have a real chance to oppose and have a say.

And at the risk of stating the hemorrhaging obvious, be careful how you complete the form. If you don't specifically nominate a proxy and leave the choices blank, you are as good as voting 'yes.' If you do want to vote 'no' mark the 'no' boxes and nominate a committed 'no' voting proxy (as listed on the savethectc site.) That covers the possibility of a trojan horse arriving on the agenda under the cover of darkness.

Surely a yay sayer armed with a bunch of explicitly no papers, duly received and recorded as such by ERS, would be guilty of a serious breach of trust and due process if they did not apply these votes accordingly?

Yep. But I must stress, as I have said before, I have no reason to believe that someone from the the pro-camp would act in such a manner.

[irc]

When Labour introduced postal voting on demand for the other vote did anyone believe that it would lead to electoral fraud on the scale of a banana republic.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/u ... 377468.ece

I don't for a minute believe that any CTC member councilor would do anything other than cast proxy votes as the member wished but it is better than elections are not only fair but seen to be fair. So if you want to vote no have someone in the "No" camp cast your proxy.

[thirdcrank]

...Yep. But I must stress, as I have said before, I have no reason to believe that someone from the the pro-camp would act in such a manner.

I'd be the last person to suggest there might be some form of vote-rigging or malpractice but there are at least two circumstances where a proxy vote could end up being cast "perfectly legally" in a way that the voter did not expect. I tried to cover this in my advice above, without spelling it out.

AFAIK:-

1. If you name a proxy who then does not attend the meeting, your proxy passes to the chair of the meeting, unless you have deleted the chair on the form as well as writing in the name of your proxy. The chair must then follow the voter's instructions on the form, but if they have left it open, trusting the discretion of their proxy, then they would end up giving that same discretion to the chair.

2. I cannot now remember the wording, but the proxy form gives the authority to vote on any other business properly coming before the meeting. That is what I meant by trojan horse.

[belgiangoth]

I'm voting no, need to email a suitable proxy.
I don't object to the change in the CTC that sees it become a Cycling promoter as opposed to a Touring Club, after all that is the main reason I joined. I do object to how this has been organised though and I think that maintaining our Touring heritage requires us to keep a wing of the CTC as a Club, not a Charity.
That said I will re-join after the AGM, though I won't take out a life membership - as planned initially.

[Regulator]

I'm voting no, need to email a suitable proxy.
I don't object to the change in the CTC that sees it become a Cycling promoter as opposed to a Touring Club, after all that is the main reason I joined. I do object to how this has been organised though and I think that maintaining our Touring heritage requires us to keep a wing of the CTC as a Club, not a Charity.
That said I will re-join after the AGM, though I won't take out a life membership - as planned initially.

I may be misunderstanding your last sentence, but if you're not a member before the AGM, then you can't vote.

[deliquium]

There have been more words and polar opinions on this subject (heated debate doesn't seem the correct description) than I can cope with.

But a decision HAS to be made. The NAY camp has my registered vote - I'm not going to bang on about why - it's too complicated.

I will not renew my membership, regardless. I'd want to see what transpires from this mayhem first.

The fall out either way will be tedious. I'll just continue to ride my bike less unencumbered, but an eensie weenie bit sadder. I have had some good feelings being a CTC member over the years.

What a mess us fellow cyclists from such a broad church have got ourselves into?

[belgiangoth]

I may be misunderstanding your last sentence, but if you're not a member before the AGM, then you can't vote.

My membership is up for renewal - after the vote.
In a couple years' time I may get a life membership - if I'm happy with what's going on with the CTC.