Cycling UK Forum

I think the big deal with flashing lights on bikes was caused by the ministry of transport's strong wish to prevent the spread of any flashing lights on vehicles, allegedly to prevent confusion. If you go back far enoguh - 1960's - the rules on emergency blue beacons allowed one to be fitted mounted on the centreline of the vehicle, above a certain height - possibly 5'. Every development since then - usually based on what equipment such as strobes, roof bars which has become commonplace in the US - has required amendments to the rules. When it was found that rear-facing red flashers were the best way (allegedly) of identifying an emergency vehicle from the rear, that had to receive ministry approval.

With the flashing lights on bikes legislation, they were really put in the King Cnut position, as I've mentioned somewhere above. So many 'otherwise law-abiding' cyclists were fitting flashers they were left with little choice but to give in - something they would never have done in a million years based on the technical effects of the lights.

On the practical side, I think that cyclists' attitudes towards lights are affected by whether they drive motor vehicles. Some cyclists who assume that their 'bobby dodgers' must be clearly visible to drivers cannot have driven a car at night. OTOH, extra-powerful rear lights are IMO quite unnecessary and if they are also flashing they risk becoming a real nuisance. Only a rubbish driver will sit in a queue of traffic with the footbrake down (or even worse, pump it up and down) partly because it is so inconsiderate to the driver behind.

In short, I'm saying that especially in urban conditions, a cyclist needs a strong front light, to be visible among cars with powerful headlights. A decent but bog-standard rear lamp, flashing or steady, such as the single LED cateye models, plus a reflector is ideal at the back. (All subject to legal requirements and BS of course.)

I was very glad of my bog standard dynamo rear AND Smart Superflash in the mist this morning. I could hear the change of direction when they were 100 yards back.

thirdcrank wrote:Only a rubbish driver will sit in a queue of traffic with the footbrake down ... partly because it is so inconsiderate to the driver behind.

There are many people round my neck of the woods where people do this, either down a hill (past speed cameras, otherwise they wouldn't bother) or at lights.

Sadly the majority of drivers ARE rubbish when it comes to keeping their foot on the brake instead of using the handbrake. Even worse when on a slight slope & they roll backwards before getting there foot on the gas
I find in urban/heavy traffic conditions a strong front flasher is more noticeable than a steady beam, the rear I have on slow strobe which is far less annoying for someone who is approaching from the rear but identifies me as a cyclist all the same. I saw a rear light pictured either on here or another forum that was ridiculous, brighter than the brake light of a car, overkill & dangerous to other road users especially if it were raining.

Tonyf33 wrote: I saw a rear light pictured either on here or another forum that was ridiculous, brighter than the brake light of a car, overkill & dangerous to other road users especially if it were raining.

Probably mine - but to be fair, I'm planning to fit a dimmer - not just for when I'm in a traffic queue, but so I can in good conscience use it on shared paths.

A key aspect of my cycling is that very little of it is on main roads in the traffic flow, and my light is designed to warn off drivers before they get too close and also to provide side-spill when I'm forced to use advisory cycle lanes and am thereby potentially threated by vans and lorries turning left in front of me.

The key point about my super-bright "be seen" lights is that I demand that following cars keep a safe distance behind me and give me a wide berth when overtaking.
I demand no more of the caged community that I do of myself when I'm forced to sit behind the wheel myself.

Not actually in response to anything I've read (I've not looked at the thread for a while) but I was out doing a jolly night ride last night and stopped to see if I could photograph the beam from my B+M Ixon. These are the shots I've got and the front light was on the dimmer of the settings but it nicely shows the beam shape if anyone's interested. Now that I've figured out how to take this type of shot I'll go and do some comparison pictures of the different beams. It might be useful for someone, and it gives me the excuse to go for a night ride. I should add that these two pics don't show the full range of the light as the photos have come out darker than reality and the beam edges have been lost. I'll rectify that on photoshoot two.

Gentlegreen: I respect the fact that you want to be seen but it can create a dangerous situation for those following/trying to pass. Firstly the light is far in excess of what would be required even in foggy conditions. I've a fairly large single LED with a built in reflector. On a dark road it can be seen from easily half a mile away, if not more.
Do you not think by having such a high level of brightness that it distracts/blinds others & thus you are creating more of a problem than you solve?

If it was raining I would be extremely peeved to be behind you, I'd liken it to the vehicle drivers who turn their fog lights on in the rain, highly dangerous...sorry

Tonyf33 wrote:I respect the fact that you want to be seen but it can create a dangerous situation for those following/trying to pass. Firstly the light is far in excess of what would be required even in foggy conditions. I've a fairly large single LED with a built in reflector. On a dark road it can be seen from easily half a mile away, if not more.
Do you not think by having such a high level of brightness that it distracts/blinds others & thus you are creating more of a problem than you solve?

If it was raining I would be extremely peeved to be behind you, I'd liken it to the vehicle drivers who turn their fog lights on in the rain, highly dangerous...sorry

My rear light is the equivalent of a fog light and a very effective one because it consists of 48 individual beams. in such conditions I wouldn't dream of setting off with less light.

And why would you be "up my bumper" in the first place ?
When I drive, I stay at a decent distance from vehicles in front - be they two-wheeled or four.
On a bike, I don't hang around cagers any more than necessary ...

That said, I'm planning to fit a dimmer, and I may make it automatically adjust to the ambient conditions ...

GeoffL wrote:... What I do object to are the blue flashing lights that I've seen a few cyclists use near where I live. I've heard the "blue is legally white" argument, but the lights to which I object are more than just tinged with blue and have been mistaken for blue lights of emergency vehicles.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Eurolight-Light ... roduct_top

I'd say they were illegal. At one point they were on sale at Argos, but they withdrew them and IIRC it was because somebody pointed out they were naughty. I picked one up cheap from TKMaxx and my grandsons find it ideal for playing at Fireman Sam (not on the road of course.)

I see from those Amazon reviews that the four reviewers take some delight in being mistaken for police. That way lies trouble. Although these seem to be intended as a seatpost mounted rear lamp, I presume these Billy Liar types fit them on the front.

The 'customers also bought' stuff at the bottom includes sirens and magnetic blue beacons. There must be some fantasy merchants out there.

The real bike bobbies have a combined system made by Lumicycle, seen several around the Sheffield area, and to the best of my knowledge they aren't BS compliant.

PW wrote:The real bike bobbies have a combined system made by Lumicycle, seen several around the Sheffield area, and to the best of my knowledge they aren't BS compliant.

I'd be surprised if there is a British Standard for flashing blue lights on pedal cycles (although on reflection, nothing would surprise me about the minute detail of lighting regs. )

Flashing lamps on pedal cycles were legalised in the Road Vehicle Lighting Regs 2005 (along other social advances, such as allowing customs officers vehicles to have emergency beacons.) The official explanatory note includes the following revelation

7.4. The use of flashing blue lamps is currently prohibited on pedal cycles. Some police forces already use such lights (particularly in congested areas where they can respond faster than cars) therefore it is necessary to amend the regulations to permit emergency services to fit blue flashing lights to pedal cycles.

The whole text is here for the benefit of red-tape afficionados. It does make "Yes Minister" look quite normal.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2005 ... df?type=em

Life used to be simpler in the old days. Before World War II the fire brigade was a part of the police. I've read a contemporary account from the early days and apparently the chief constable was in the habit of standing on top of the (presumably horse-drawn) fire engine and shouting "Get out of the way".

thirdcrank wrote:Life used to be simpler in the old days. Before World War II the fire brigade was a part of the police. I've read a contemporary account from the early days and apparently the chief constable was in the habit of standing on top of the (presumably horse-drawn) fire engine and shouting "Get out of the way".

But now drivers (a small minority I'll grant) require their noise generators to be loud enough to drown a jumbo, so that wouldn't work (mind you the sirens often don't against those imbeciles.

Many years ago I briefly had a job installing a public address/fire alarm system in a building in the city of London. I traveled in every day using the tube line, but when it came to the big day to do the final commissioning/testing, my boss was going to turn up as well. He was going to drive into London and I would have the privilege of accompanying him (because he wasn't going to be carrying any equipment, that was my job). So he is driving along a very congested route. There is a bit of a kerfuffle going on behind us, someone seems to be impatient. We carry along the road for a good bit. Then a white transit van with a blue flashing light on top (but no sirens), pulls along side with a police man leaning out of the passenger side window, shouting rather angrily "Use your bloody mirrors!". The transit van then speeds off past the line of traffic. I'm trying not to laugh while my boss sits there pretending that this never happened.

After reading this thread, I bought a Cree P4 on eBay (£15 free postage) and used it for the first time tonight. It was excellent, I was easily able to cycle off-road (forest tracks near my home in The National Forest) at up to 15mph. I would definitely recommend one.