m2.5 stainless washers vs brass (for spoke heads)

[SA_SA_SA]

m2.5 stainless washers vs brass (for spoke heads):

is there any reason why stainless washers wouldnt do instead when building wheels and protected spoke elbows from thin flanges by spacing with m2.5(8ba) washers?

[CREPELLO]

Stainless is a lot harder than brass and standard washers are probably a bit thicker than spoke head washers. I think brass would provide a better seating - the washer does afterall have to mould to the taper of the head. Is there any reason why you would want to use stainless?

[531colin]

I don't see why stainless washers would be any less effective (or ineffective?) than brass.

As I understand it, washers are used to "space out" the spoke head from a thin flange, so that the spoke bend is within or close to the flange, and thus "supported" instead of the bend being out in the fresh air, and "un-supported". I would love somebody to do a controlled experiment on this. All it needs is somebody who has a hub where this is seen to be a problem, to build the wheel with washers on half the circumference of the hub, and no washers on the other half. In fact, I am sufficiently interested to volunteer to build it for free.

Just seen Crepello's post....are we now looking at a hub laced with a third brass washers, a third stainless, and a third bare?

[rjb]

I don't see why stainless washers would be any less effective (or ineffective?) than brass.

As I understand it, washers are used to "space out" the spoke head from a thin flange, so that the spoke bend is within or close to the flange, and thus "supported" instead of the bend being out in the fresh air, and "un-supported". I would love somebody to do a controlled experiment on this. All it needs is somebody who has a hub where this is seen to be a problem, to build the wheel with washers on half the circumference of the hub, and no washers on the other half. In fact, I am sufficiently interested to volunteer to build it for free.

Just seen Crepello's post....are we now looking at a hub laced with a third brass washers, a third stainless, and a third bare?

Of course you could only do this with a 36 or 48 spoked wheel as you would have to even out the spacing and ensure both trailing and leading spokes were evened out accordingly. ie in the case of a 36 spoked wheel you would have 3 brass, 3 s/s and 3 unsupported leading spokes per side and the same arrangement of trailing spokes, then you would need to do the same for the other flange. And you would have to ensure that the order was the same ie brass, s/s, unsupported, and reverse the wheel at regular intervals to ensure that the order was reversed (just in case this had an effect). Then you would need to keep records of the routes to ensure this was not compromising the road testing phase. And the subsequent analysis would keep you entertained all winter

I am glad i am not doing it Colin, i am confused already

Best of luck, and dont forget to post a picture of it here,

[531colin]

Yes, with 3 flavours, sample size is going to be a bit small, isnt it, I hadn't thought of that.
I imagine the spokes most likely to fail will be driveside (more tension), but also heads out, rather than heads in, where the bend (usually) lies closer to the flange. That gives a sample size of 3 spokes......
Although when I am replacing failed spokes in other people's wheels, I cant say I pay any attention to the heads in/out business.