Cycling UK Forum

"Does anyone know"...

Any measurement compensations factors for a man riding on a lady's sprung saddle?

First 25 miles using 'Std' workings = Agony.
Second 25 miles using guestimation.. Better.

In the absense of retrieveable data, I shall continue with 'trial and error'.
It would be interesting to compare my findings with 'prior art'.

I am female & need to put my men's saddle further forward on the bike than my women's saddles. So you might have the opposite. I can't think of anything else that might help.

Both the women in this family insist on riding B17s. Last time I bought a "Ladies" saddle as a surprise I was told very rapidly where to shove it!

I put my saddle into position through trial and error.

Now it's perfect for me. This trial and error event was many years ago on a previous previous previous previous bike. Now I know what position it is in, I can transfer the facts to any bike.

It was only comparatively recently that I found there was a "standard" way of positioning a saddle! This "standard" way is only a rule of thumb, and adjustments are always necessary - unless you are lucky!

Therefore, Ayesha, use trial and error and don't go through agony. You should be able to position your saddle in only a few miles - then adjust - then do a few more - then adjust. Take a spanner or two with you.

The story behing this is I mentioned to a friend I fancied a Brooks B67 for my Raleigh 20.
He has leant me a sprung ladies saddle of indescript origin. It has a plastic covered sponge top, two springs like the B67 and is exceptionally wide.

I have ridden to work this morning in reasonable comfort after dropping the saddle height another 1/8" from yesterday's setting. The roads were icey, so I took it careful and therefore couldn't get a measure of the result, although with only wearing office trousers over M&S undies, it wasn't uncomfortable.

Do I double the value of the bike by fitting a B67 ???

I'll ride across Brum to Cadbury World after work tomorrow ( they're closed today ), fill up the panniers and see how the latest adjustment is.

The best place to start is like this.

With saddle horizontal and pedal fully down, your bare heel with your foot parallel to the ground should be about 5mm off the pedal. That is sitting square on the saddle. How do you measure 5mm? You get it so that the heel touches. Then raise saddle 5mm.

Easiest way to do it is sit on bike next to a wall or a chair. Lock brakes with elastic bands etc.

You can vary this a little plus or minus 5mm. This is nearly always comfortable.

Fore and aft?

Place an elbow against the nose of the saddle and you fingers should just touch the handlebars. You can move this 5mm back and forth too.

It'll get you in the right ball-park to start to get it right.

Ayesha
I'm sure a chap of your not inconsiderable experience will sus it in a very short while/miles,or come to the conclusion that the saddle isn't suited to your saddle interface

Ayesha wrote:The story behing this is I mentioned to a friend I fancied a Brooks B67 for my Raleigh 20.
He has leant me a sprung ladies saddle of indescript origin. It has a plastic covered sponge top, two springs like the B67 and is exceptionally wide.

What you're describing sounds very like the original saddle your R20 may have had. They are amazingly comfortable but do tend to lack in the looks department. I use a flyer on my Kingpin, its good but I sometimes wish the springs were a little softer. I recently got hold of a Lepper Weltmeister leather saddle for my Revelation and I am very impressed. If you are riding 20" wheels with no suspension mattress sprung seems to be the way to go. Half the price of a Brooks, looks just as good and takes less breaking in. The downside is it weighs over 1KG but thats dutch bicycle design for you

Mick F wrote:Fore and aft?

Place an elbow against the nose of the saddle and you fingers should just touch the handlebars. You can move this 5mm back and forth too.

It'll get you in the right ball-park to start to get it right.

I always shared this rule of thumb belief and never could get comfortable on a bike with distances over 50 miles, had a bike fitting session with Paul Hewitt, he set my Chevoit SE up for me and I can cover any distance without discomfort. End result is with my elbow against the nose of the saddle and my fingers pointing towards the handlebars there is now a distance of 80mm between fingertips and handlebars. Perfection is not just an accident.

johnb wrote:

Mick F wrote:Fore and aft?

Place an elbow against the nose of the saddle and you fingers should just touch the handlebars. You can move this 5mm back and forth too.

It'll get you in the right ball-park to start to get it right.

I always shared this rule of thumb belief and never could get comfortable on a bike with distances over 50 miles, had a bike fitting session with Paul Hewitt, he set my Chevoit SE up for me and I can cover any distance without discomfort. End result is with my elbow against the nose of the saddle and my fingers pointing towards the handlebars there is now a distance of 80mm between fingertips and handlebars. Perfection is not just an accident.

I don't think this formula is very helpful at all, least of all when it's a woman's saddle. The nose on them is shorter.

I've just checked my Dawes Audax, which I've spent considerable time working on the correct saddle position. Like JohnB's Cheviot, the elbow to finger tip measurement leaves me with something like an 80mm gap to the bars too! I should check my Chevy tomorrow and would expect it to have virtually the same distance.

I don't think the setup is different for a woman's saddle. It's where your sit bones go that's important. Width would be wider than most men's saddles - maybe it's just too wide for your behind? The short nose is supposed to make them more skirt friendly, that's all.

reohn2 wrote:Ayesha
I'm sure a chap of your not inconsiderable experience will sus it in a very short while/miles,or come to the conclusion that the saddle isn't suited to your saddle interface

On the contrary.

I went out straight from work ( in office trousers over Marks' undies ) with the seat 1/8" lower than I adjusted on Sunday afternoon ( the seat pin clamp is a lever, not a nut ). I got to Birmingham Centre ( 9 miles ) fine.
After visiting Waterstones, I got the adjustable wrench out and shifted the saddle 1/4" forward. I got home ( 10 miles ) in acceptable comfort.

I changed clothing to proper bike shorts and fleece jogging trousers, ( with suitable upper body attire ), and rode back to Birmingham Centre, back to Waterstones to buy another Christmas gift I'd seen earlier. SUPREME comfort ! Then it started raining. The antics of some motroists during my ride home is another story

So after approx 100 miles containing 4 adjustments from 'std', its 1/4" lower and 1/4" forward. This means my leg extension is less, reducing pressure on the underside of my upper leg against the saddle's wide flare.


I phoned my friend and agreed £5 for permanent ownership of the non-descript lady's saddle.

Sorry Spa Cycles, a £56 Brooks B67 sale lost.

CREPELLO wrote:

johnb wrote:

Mick F wrote:Fore and aft?

Place an elbow against the nose of the saddle and you fingers should just touch the handlebars. You can move this 5mm back and forth too.

It'll get you in the right ball-park to start to get it right.

I always shared this rule of thumb belief and never could get comfortable on a bike with distances over 50 miles, had a bike fitting session with Paul Hewitt, he set my Chevoit SE up for me and I can cover any distance without discomfort. End result is with my elbow against the nose of the saddle and my fingers pointing towards the handlebars there is now a distance of 80mm between fingertips and handlebars. Perfection is not just an accident.

I don't think this formula is very helpful at all, least of all when it's a woman's saddle. The nose on them is shorter.

I've just checked my Dawes Audax, which I've spent considerable time working on the correct saddle position. Like JohnB's Cheviot, the elbow to finger tip measurement leaves me with something like an 80mm gap to the bars too! I should check my Chevy tomorrow and would expect it to have virtually the same distance.

I don't think the setup is different for a woman's saddle. It's where your sit bones go that's important. Width would be wider than most men's saddles - maybe it's just too wide for your behind? The short nose is supposed to make them more skirt friendly, that's all.

Yeh, this is a myth, and I was surprised to see Mike Burrows advocating it.

Being a 'lazy' ride bike with a shallow seat angle, I set the Fore/Aft to KOPS where the very front of the Knee is over the pedal spindle ( about 1/4" forward of the tibial tuberosity, with a gent's saddle ). Now KOPS is above the tibial tuberosity as per a more upright seat tube sports bike.

Congratulations you have just found out that it is not all about the most efficient race position. You have to change some of the race concepts to match something that is often referred to as "Comfort Cycling".
Most if not all of the theories about riding position go out of the window when using this sort of equipment, maybe you should go the a proper LBS not one of the racing lot and get fitted properly for this type of bike.

Mick F wrote:Fore and aft?

Place an elbow against the nose of the saddle and you fingers should just touch the handlebars. You can move this 5mm back and forth too.

It'll get you in the right ball-park to start to get it right.

I measured mine Mick and I'm just 4.99999999999 mm short of the handlebars!

This is for bullhorn bars which I now very much favour over drops. I never suffer hand discomfort with these.