What hubgear

[ukdodger]

My son wants a commuting/fun bike. About twenty miles a day through Surrey/Sussex. Fairly hilly, I've cycled the route. I'm going to make it for him but am undecided about what hubgear to buy. He's not the sort unlike his old man to take too much care of his machine. He's definitely a hop on and go until it doesnt sort of cyclist. So I reckon a dérailleur would only stress him out. Anyway. I aint gonna pay for a Rohloff, I dont like the Shimano 11 which I have and apart from the Sram i9 which is no longer made and I wouldnt buy anyway I have no other experience. I'd like some recommendations if pos from bikers who have other HG's.

Thanks

[s1965c]

How fit is he?

My disgustingly fit teenage oaf / son would be perfectly happy here in hilly Devon with a Sturmey AW 3 speed, and in NIG form they're as fit and forget as they come. I've ridden one for several thousand miles for the last couple of winters, and they just go on and on and on....

By way of contrast, I've also run a Nexus 8 in similar conditions. The extra gear range was nice to have, but I didn't find it as robust, and was more sensitive to cable adjustment.

[Bicycler]

Depends how far you wanted to go down the 'fit and forget'/low maintenance route but I know someone who uses SA gears/drums/dynamos:
SA do versions of their hubs with well-regarded long-lasting drum brakes. Drums will respond better to little maintenance than a rim brake where you may find yourself dealing with prematurely worn rims. Have the front as a dynohub/drum brake and there's no issue with forgetting lights. Problems would be some extra weight and possibly getting the gears low enough if you went for the SA 8-speed. A stronger disc-type fork could be advisable if going for the larger 90mm drums, they are meant to be really quite powerful.

[WrightsW5]

Sturmey Archer 3 speed should be good enough if riders used to do the TdF on them. I have ridden 3 speeds for years, no problem. The rear cog is simple to take off and put whatever teeth number you choose.

[ukdodger]

How fit is he?

My disgustingly fit teenage oaf / son would be perfectly happy here in hilly Devon with a Sturmey AW 3 speed, and in NIG form they're as fit and forget as they come. I've ridden one for several thousand miles for the last couple of winters, and they just go on and on and on....

By way of contrast, I've also run a Nexus 8 in similar conditions. The extra gear range was nice to have, but I didn't find it as robust, and was more sensitive to cable adjustment.

Not very is the answer. Which is one reason he wants the bike. He's in his mid thirties and hasnt ridden since his early twenties. I think the SA (which I've had too and they're magnificent. I had it for about twenty five years and did bugger all to it and still it kept on shifting and going!)) but I think only three gears wouldnt be enough. The Shimano 11 is far too sensitive but you're saying so is the Nexus 8. How bad is it? The 11 needs almost constant adjusting. It will jump every ten miles or so and that's the best I can get out of it. It's like trying to balance a pencil on it's point. Is the 8 that bad?

[Paulatic]

I built my current commuting bike 4 yrs ago and built a wheel using SRAM 7 sp with back pedal brake. It's a 20ml ride and I love it. Not too hilly so only really use fears 3 4 &5 but it nice to know the others are there when needed.

[ukdodger]

Sturmey Archer 3 speed should be good enough if riders used to do the TdF on them. I have ridden 3 speeds for years, no problem. The rear cog is simple to take off and put whatever teeth number you choose.

SA did a 5 too didnt they? I dont think 3 is enough. Ok for short reasonably flat rides but it wouldnt be enough for me on his commute.

[Elizabethsdad]

Alfine 8 speed - I have a Carrera Subway 8 with this hubgear and it has been lovely. I have another bike with the Alfine 11 which is good too. I have also riden a bike with the NuVinci N360 hub and liked that enough that my next bike will have that. In fact when I do I will need to sell at least one of my current bikes - fancy buying the Subway?

[ukdodger]

Alfine 8 speed - I have a Carrera Subway 8 with this hubgear and it has been lovely. I have another bike with the Alfine 11 which is good too. I have also riden a bike with the NuVinci N360 hub and liked that enough that my next bike will have that. In fact when I do I will need to sell at least one of my current bikes - fancy buying the Subway?

Lol. No thanks. That NuVinci is rather odd having gears without teeth. I wouldnt trust it not to slip sooner or later.

[niggle]

I also have a Carrera Subway 8 and would say that if an SA 3 spd has been ruled out then the Alfine 8 speed would be a good choice. In my experience it may need a couple of cable adjustments in the first few miles, then occasional adjustments after that, e.g. once every 2-3000 miles. It seems pretty tough and costs less than offerings from SRAM, and you can fit a SA 1/8" sprocket and £4 1/8" bushed chain for a further reduction in maintenance.

[WrightsW5]

Sturmey Archer 3 speed should be good enough if riders used to do the TdF on them. I have ridden 3 speeds for years, no problem. The rear cog is simple to take off and put whatever teeth number you choose.

SA did a 5 too didnt they? I dont think 3 is enough. Ok for short reasonably flat rides but it wouldnt be enough for me on his commute.

Yes, they do 5 which I haven't tried. If you wanted to go vintage they did a 4.

[Brucey]

Of the modern hubs with 7+ gears then the Nexus/Alfine 8 is the best proven value/performance. If you set gear 5 as normal then it is (unlike the Nexus 7) quite efficient overall, too.

The SA five speed exists in different forms; the latest version is the C50 hub but we don't know what that is like yet. SA hubs are nice with hub brakes fitted; very low maintenance, without the weight, need to grease and drag worries of shimano roller brakes.

cheers

[barrym]

If you set gear 5 as normal then it is (unlike the Nexus 7) quite efficient overall, too.

Can you elaborate on this please? I don't understand what you mean.

Thanks

[Brucey]

gear 5 in a nexus 8 is direct drive, which is (if set 'normal' i.e. around 65") the most used gear in flat and rolling terrain. Of the 8 gears only three (2,3,4) use both gear trains in series in an irrational (i.e. gear down then gear up again) fashion.

By contrast the middle gears in the Nexus 7 (even the ratio that is almost direct drive) all use the gearsets in an irrational fashion; they are the least efficient gears as a consequence. Unlike the premium Nexus 8 and Alfine gears the pinions are not on roller bearings, either. To have the last efficient gears the most used is a bad arrangement for overall efficiency. The N7 gear has many other strengths, but best efficiency isn't one of them.

Simpler hubs like the SA 5 speed ones are usually more efficient than the worst gears in a dual train hub like the Nexus 7 and 8 gears, and often have a high overall efficiency.

cheers

[barrym]

Thanks Brucey. A bit clearer, although I certainly need to do more homework it would appear.