Motorists have ruined England

[Bicycler]

The most numerous users of the roads were always pedestrians. The first constructed roads of this island were made for the benefit of marching Roman soldiers.

The whole "roads were built for..." argument is a nonsense. By and large roads were not 'built' so much as improved, existing paths and tracks being widened, surfaced or diverted in response to the increased burden of new road users. At no point was the intention to exclude the existing users of the roads for the convenience of the new ones.

It would be ridiculous for motorists (or indeed cyclists) to regard the huge publicly funded improvements in roads which have been required for the benefit of motorists (or cyclists) as evidence of greater entitlement to the roads. The humble pedestrian requires little provision yet has seen himself marginalised despite contributing equally to the costs. If any, I would say that his is the greater entitlement.

[[XAP]Bob]

Roads were built for road users.

The current favoured surface (tarmac) was widely deployed after campaigning by cyclists, and it enabled the motor car revolution (nothing like unintended consequences).

That's what is meant by "roads weren't built for cars" it's not a statement that they were built for cyclists, but a rebuttal of the "my road" attitude of a certain class of road user who believes that beer tax pays for breweries, and tobacco tax pays for plantations.

[Mick F]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarmac
Invented in 1834 in Millwall by John Henry Cassell.

The Maccadam system re-invented by Mr Mc Adam in Scotland and was ok for the turnpikes but as the speed of the vehicles increased, it wore away too easily. Also rains washed away the top layer, and in dry spells it was too dusty. The Romans had the system originally, but paved the top layer.

Pitch, and later tar, was a great improvement to maccadam, but personally I doubt that it was only the cyclists who got it used widely.

[[XAP]Bob]

personally I doubt that it was only the cyclists who got it used widely.

I'm sure it wasn't exclusively, but we were a significant campaigning voice...

[Mick F]

Yes, I've read that and I know it seems to be a "fact", but I doubt it was as much as we'd like to think. Possibly at first, but not for long.

I wouldn't like to guess when every road in Britain became tarmac'd but maybe as late as the 1950's?
Obviously the roads done first would have been major roads in towns and it would have been a very slow process to get all the roads done. By that time, cyclists would have been a very small voice.

[Mick F]

Anyone fancy doing a jigsaw?
http://thejigsawpuzzles.com/Cars-and-Bi ... saw-puzzle?

[Bicycler]

Yes, I've read that and I know it seems to be a "fact", but I doubt it was as much as we'd like to think. Possibly at first, but not for long.

I wouldn't like to guess when every road in Britain became tarmac'd but maybe as late as the 1950's?
Obviously the roads done first would have been major roads in towns and it would have been a very slow process to get all the roads done. By that time, cyclists would have been a very small voice.

Depends what you mean by every road. Obviously there is still a minority which remain unsurfaced, cobbled or with some other kind of surface. There is also how long campaigning was required. Sure, the process of tarmacking roads may not have been completed until after the 2nd World War but were motoring organisations really having to campaign for it at that point? It was probably decided to start a continuous programme of tarmacking the roads much earlier but the scale of the task and the finances resources meant it wasn't completed for many years.

[Mick F]

I understand that the A390 though our village and up Gunnislake Hill was tarmac'd in 1944 to help with the D Day preparations. It was the Yanks and their tank transporters who needed a good road.

[MikeF]

I wouldn't like to guess when every road in Britain became tarmac'd but maybe as late as the 1950's?

I would almost certainly say after the late 1950's. I can recall roads that weren't. Also many houses didn't have piped water til the late 1950's and that was definitely the case in Cornwall - it was well water!

Motor vehicles cause many times the damage to roads than do cyclists or pedestrians. Those motorists that claim cyclists do not pay "road tax" perhaps need reminding about that relative damage. How often is a pavement resurfaced? Usually when it has been used by motor vehicles.

[al_yrpal]

When we holidayed in North Cornwall in 1946. The water came from the farmhouse well, I went to the farm across the unsurfaced road to collect the milk in a pail in the morning and the cotted cream was made slowly on the range. The taxi could only get us so far from Camelford station. The pony and trap did the last bit on the track. Now, the whole area is unrecognisable, the toffs have moved in and the roads have been widened and surfaced. The whole area has been ruined by motor cars, its lost its charm, but thats so called progress.

Al

[Lance Dopestrong]

I can remember as a kid in the 60's certain side roads weren't tarmac'd. In the village where I now live the street was built in 1960 and where the road surface is knackered the original concrete road underneath is showing through.

[pete75]

R

After the battle of Trafalgar, the news was rushed to London from Falmouth in West Cornwall by horse and mail-coach 200odd miles in only 30hrs up what is now called the A30.

This was October 1805, well before the invention of the bicycle.

There's quite a tale to that Mick. Don't know if you've read this http://www.nmmc.co.uk/images/uploads/Tr ... 20Dash.pdf

[Mick F]

Excellent.
Good info!

My point about roads, is the fact that roads were used and improved for "traffic", not for bicycles or cars, just for traffic, and mainly for horses and carriages.

If anyone is cycling up the Old A30 and leaves Launceston on their way to Okehampton, they will see signs saying "Trafalgar Way" and there's a plaque to read in Lifton. If you go further up the Old A30 towards Exeter, there's more commemorative signs and logos to see. Old A30 is an excellent cycling road, and well worth the ride.
Here's a logo for instance.
https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=cherit ... .93,,2,5.9