Keeping bike after recievng compensation

[Ben_]

Recently I hit an unmarked sped-bump at speed, (the road had been freshly laid - but the road-marking hadn't been done) and there were no shadows showing the rise and no indication of the presence of a speed-bump. I was on one of my racing bike so I was travelling at a fair rate of knots. My front fork and wheel took a pounding. I reported the issue to the council they initially denied there was any problem, but when I provided photographic & video evidence and pointed out the relevant sections in the Department for Transport Traffic signs manual, they conceded the road markings weren't correct.

They are now prepared to offer me some compensation, but they want to keep the entire bike. Is this normal/allowable?
In my only other cycling related accident (knocked off by car) the other paid for a replacement bike, I kept the old bike (although all I did was take it to the local recycling centre/dump).

It's primarily the fork and wheel that's damaged, most of the rest of the bike have been re-used. I've provided them with quotations for the replacement parts.

With my other accident I used a solicitor, with this incident I've just gone direct to the local council, thinking it would be cheaper/easier.

[pete75]

If they are offering you enough money to replace the whole bike they are entitled to have the old bike to sell and mitigate their loss.
No different to a written off car - the insurance company pay out for the vehicle, the remains of which become theirs to sell.

[chris_suffolk]

I would guess if they have paid out the market value of the bike (as with a car) not necessarily the new price, as it will have depreciated in value, then they can take the damaged bike in exchange. Not a solicitor, but as has been said, that's what happens with a car.

Only leverage you should have is that the money paid out is enough to replace like for like, and if that means there are no secondhand bikes available then they will probably have to provide new.

I would have expected them to buy replacement parts if that's more economic than a whole bike, but maybe a whole bike is cheaper.

[beardy]

Their offer is just that, an offer. You dont have to accept it.

You can also put in a counter offer, if the amount that they have offered exceeds the amount that you need for a repair, then make a conditional acceptance with the proviso that you can buy back the old bike for a specified amount.

On a similar note I had a £2,000 payout on a motorcycle from insurers, I accepted on condition I could buy back the scrap for £50. They forgot to bill me for the £50.

I dont know what they intend doing with the scrap of your bike and buying it back may be a problem solved for them.

[samsbike]

If they are offering you enough money to replace the whole bike they are entitled to have the old bike to sell and mitigate their loss.
No different to a written off car - the insurance company pay out for the vehicle, the remains of which become theirs to sell.

+1 or you can get them to replace the offending parts.

[JohnW]

The Council seem to have accepted liability - it seems that they've accepted the fact, and only the price is now at issue. It sounds to me that they don't understand the situation - the matter is probably being dealt with by a clerk with no knowledge of bikes or of cycling. I'd get the CTC legal eagles on-board (assuming you're a CTC member). OK - the Council want your heap of damaged steel, but you should then have a new bike, the equivalent of the original.

You say that you were on a 'racing bike' when you hit the defect; that suggests to me custom built bike and made to measure frame. If the frame was (as I suppose) in perfect order, not previously damaged and not previously repaired then surely the least that you should receive is a new frame in that condition - and including new parts to replace the damaged parts and stripping down and rebuilding costs........and then there's associated costs and inconvenience. You need a quotation from a decent framebuilder/bikeshop.

Do let us know how you get on.

[andrewjoseph]

why a custom bike? a 'racing bike' is generally held to be anything with drop bars.

as to no damage to frame, if the forks are damaged there is good chance that at least the head tube is too, possible downtube and other areas are out of alignment.

[JohnW]

why a custom bike? a 'racing bike' is generally held to be anything with drop bars.

as to no damage to frame, if the forks are damaged there is good chance that at least the head tube is too, possible downtube and other areas are out of alignment.

Ah - well - let me explain. A 'racing bike' is a bike built for the purpose of racing. If you're racing then obviously you want to win, which means getting the best performance and to get the best performance, whether time-trialling, road racing or any of the track events, the frame and subsequently the whole bike is measured and specifically built for the rider who is doing the racing. I agree that the lay person, who doesn't cycle, will interpret anything with drops as a 'racing bike', but we are cyclists among cyclists on the Forum.

As to damage, the frame really needs to be examined and assessed by a frame builder - there can be damage that we can't see. I was hit a couple of months ago and my frame was damaged but not very obviously so and only a close examination has revealed that all the main tubes are deflected. I did see some of the damage myself but only to one tube. Now it's been pointed out by a framebuilder I can see it all.

Damage in a prang can be a funny thing. I once came off on ice and broke (yes, broke) both cranks and the front changer, but there was no other damage - not even a scratch. How do you explain that? I once wrote a frame off in a strange prang where something got caught in my front wheel. The frame and forks were twisted like spaghetti but the rear wheel didn't even go out of true, and the front wheel was only very slightly deflected and was trued up by my wheelbuilder so easily that he didn't charge. Strange things happen in prangs.

If Ben's bike is a 'racing bike' in laymens' terms then it may very well not be a custom-built............but if the frame is alu or carbon, then to me a prang would mean concealed damage and a new frame.

[Ben_]

Thanks for the info.

I suppose it makes sense, that they may wish to keep the bike (although it's value will be pretty much nill). When someone drove into the back of my car about 10 years ago - the insurance paid out and took the old (written off) car off my hands without any quibbles from me. So it's reasonable that they may wish to do the same with a bike.

When I say "racing bike" I mean one of my racing steads that I use for racing rather than one of my bikes I use for commuting etc...

[Mark1978]

It entirely depends what the offer is and how it relates to the replacement cost of the bike; which you haven't told us.

As for racing bike it's unusual to hear that these days. It's normally 'road bike'. Racing bike conjures up images of old steel frames with down tube shifters.

[Edwards]

if the offer of payment includes the term "Without Prejudice" this is a legal phrase to state the offer is not binding on their part.
If it is anywhere on the letter write back asking for any binding offer.

[broadway]

if the offer of payment includes the term "Without Prejudice" this is a legal phrase to state the offer is not binding on their part.
If it is anywhere on the letter write back asking for any binding offer.

It actually means that they offering compensation without admitting liability i.e. you can't site it as evidence that they admit they are fault.

[JohnW]

.....................Racing bike conjures up images of old steel frames with down tube shifters.

Hey - watch it Mark - both my remaining bikes answer to that description , as does the frame I used for a bit of time trialling unptitwiddly years ago . When the settlement comes through for the bike someone wrote off for me just after Christmas, I'll get a steel, custom hand-built with lugs for downtube friction levers . I know what's best .

[drossall]

Presumably the premise of the offer is that the bike is a write off, and the offer is commensurate. I'd be concerned that, if I appeared keen to keep the bike, the other party might conclude that it was not in fact written off, and their offer had been excessive, or founded on incorrect information.

[thirdcrank]

... They are now prepared to offer me some compensation, but they want to keep the entire bike. Is this normal/allowable? ...

Speaking as a layman and AFAIK, they seem to have accepted liability so the issue is how much compo? You are, I believe, entitled to be put back in the position you were in before this happened. In broad terms, that might be done in either of two ways ie: repair the bike properly or replace it. Either of these might most easily be achieved by giving you the equivalent £££. Settling "out of court" like this inevitably involves negotiation; the sums involved are relatively small (as compared with personal injury) so legal advice is disproportionately expensive. You have to haggle DIY to get the deal which suits you and as has been pointed out, the greater value you put on the old bike, the less generous they may be with the £££ if you insist that they return it as part of the deal.

One other thing to bear in mind is that public bodies have audit procedures which tend to prevent anything being done on the nod. Where a private company might prioritise a quick result and move on to minimise the expense, a local authority may need to tick a lot of boxes. Put another way, the person negotiating with you may have less discretion to negotiate than their private sector equivalent.